Its true luutzu, too far to the right and a lot of people become very unhappy.Likewise too far left.
You have to govern from the center so everyone is equally, but relatively less unhappy:
Calls for David Cameron to step in after US bars British Muslim family from trip
Labour’s Stella Creasy writes to PM after party of 11 heading to Disneyland were told by American officials at Gatwick they could not go
The prime minister is facing calls to challenge the US over its refusal to allow a British Muslim family to board a flight from Gatwick to Los Angeles, to visit Disneyland.
Stella Creasy, the Labour MP for Walthamstow, has written to the prime minister after a family party of 11, about to embark on a dream holiday for which they had saved for months, were approached by officials from US homeland security as they queued in the departure lounge and told their authorisation to travel had been cancelled, without further explanation.
Creasy said she is concerned that a growing number of British Muslims are saying they have had similar experiences of being barred from the US without being told the reasons for the exclusion.
The family, from Creasy’s constituency in north-east London, had applied for and were granted travel authorisation online some weeks before their scheduled 15 December flight.
Speaking to the Guardian, Mohammad Tariq Mahmood, who was travelling with his brother and nine of their children aged between eight and 19, said they had been given no explanation for the last minute cancellation, but he believed the reason was obvious: “It’s because of the attacks on America – they think every Muslim poses a threat.”
..... The MP, having “hit a brick wall” in her own attempts to get answers from the American embassy, has asked the prime minister to press US officials for an explanation for the Mahmood family’s exclusion. She has also asked him to clarify whether the UK monitors the numbers and ethnic or religious background of those who are blocked from travelling, to “help reassure all UK citizens that no discrimination on the grounds of faith is happening at UK airports”.
Mahmood said neither he nor his brother, Mohammad Zahid Mahmood, had ever been in trouble with the police. They have been told by the airline they were to travel with that the £9,000 cost of their flights, for which they had been saving for many months, will not be refunded.
The family were escorted from the airport but were first obliged to return every item they had bought from the airport’s duty-free shops, he said. “I have never been more embarrassed in my life. I work here, I have a business here. But we were alienated.”
With no explanation of the reasons for their exclusion, he said, the family have no idea whether they will face similar treatment if they try to travel again in future. In particular, he said, he is concerned that he may never be able to visit the family of his other brother, a US citizen, who lives in southern California.
Donald Trumps rabid anti Muslim hype is having its effects. He said that America should simply ban Muslims entering the country. Right now it seems that Homeland security is reinforcing that line by arbitary withdrawal of visa to internationals travellers who are Islamic.
How to win friends and influence people..the American way.
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With this, and a number of other examples, as precedents why would any person with an Islamic sounding name consider visiting the US for any reason? To run the risk of arbitrary insult and the loss of thousands of dollars of travel costs. Just wrong.
There *could* be more to this. While I wouldn't put it past the Americans to injudiciously do such things, there could be a reason this family was targeted.Donald Trumps rabid anti Muslim hype is having its effects. He said that America should simply ban Muslims entering the country. Right now it seems that Homeland security is reinforcing that line by arbitary withdrawal of visa to internationals travellers who are Islamic.
How to win friends and influence people..the American way.
______________________________________________________________________
With this, and a number of other examples, as precedents why would any person with an Islamic sounding name consider visiting the US for any reason? To run the risk of arbitrary insult and the loss of thousands of dollars of travel costs. Just wrong.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/23/no-fly-list-operates-in-secret-power-to-exclude
The 'No Fly List' operates in secret, and its power to exclude is vast
Jeffrey Kahn
The standard for inclusion is often based on a ‘predictive judgment’, a ‘reasonable suspicion’ that someone is a ‘suspected terrorist’
Thursday 24 December 2015 06.04 AEDT
The No Fly List is not a government program easily challenged. Indeed, it operates in secrecy, from an undisclosed location, administered by an office – the Terrorist Screening Center – that doesn’t accept public inquiries. When challenged in court, the watchlisters routinely declare their methods safe but secret and fight the disclosure of their standards and criteria for inclusion.
The British Muslim family recently denied travel to Disneyland might soon discover this, despite the fact that Prime Minister David Cameron has been called upon to examine the case.
The Guardian reported that, despite prior US approvals, the entire family was turned away from Gatwick’s departure lounge. Without warning or a hearing, their freedom to travel was stripped away at great expense and deep humiliation. Instantly, they were reduced to the status of suspected terrorists by anonymous US officials working without any judicial oversight.
Imagine your family in their shoes. If you can’t, then you don’t understand the power of the US No Fly List.
Just ask Ayman Latif, an honorably discharged US marine who sought to return home from abroad to shore up his veteran’s benefits. Without any offered reason or warning, he was exiled by a system that he has spent the last five years challenging in federal court.
Or ask Rahinah Ibrahim, now a distinguished architect and scholar. As a Stanford University graduate student she found herself arrested and handcuffed in front of her young daughter when she sought to travel from San Francisco to an academic conference. Her eight years of litigation finally uncovered that an FBI agent had mistakenly watchlisted her; the presiding judge labeled it “a bureaucratic analogy to a surgeon amputating the wrong digit”. (Full disclosure: I testified on behalf of Dr Ibrahim at the first and only such trial held so far.)
Or ask many others (whose stories are told in my book on the subject) who say they found themselves at the tender mercies of government officials – typically FBI agents – offering their help to get off the list in exchange for becoming government informants when they returned home.
It’s not just Muslim names on this sad list. Although accusations of racial profiling have haunted the use of the No Fly List in the past, for every Mohammad Tariq Mahmood (one of the Gatwick 11), there is a Cat Stevens or Ted Kennedy or John Lewis.
In this story, however, lies a cautionary tale for travelers regardless of citizenship or religion.
Thanks to some courageous lawyering in tough, often pro bono cases, startling information has been pried from officials: the standard for inclusion on this list is often based on a “predictive judgment”, a “reasonable suspicion” that someone is a “suspected terrorist” presenting some sort of future threat.
“In other words”, one federal judge wrote, clearly dismayed by the departure from traditional legal requirements that someone be guilty of some action before deprived of their rights, “an American citizen can find himself labeled a suspected terrorist because of a ‘reasonable suspicion’ based on a ‘reasonable suspicion’.”
It's messed up for Democrats to use the no-fly list to push for gun laws
Indeed, the cautionary tale grows grimmer still. For there is no logical reason why terrorist watchlists need be limited to air travel. Indeed, few realize how many watchlists already exist until they find themselves in their crushing grip. There is, of course, a watchlist for maritime travel. And this month President Obama urged the use of the No Fly List to deny access to firearms.
Whatever one’s views of the second amendment to the constitution, the evidence is unmistakable. A list once confined to stopping hijackers and 9/11 style bombers has grown into the go-to tool for government officials who don’t like their predictive judgments questioned by lawyers and judges.
Slowly, federal lawsuits have forced some light on to this system and forced back the worst abuses. But there is still a long way to go. Whatever US officials suspect of this British family, they deserve respect for the fundamental right we all must protect at our peril: equal justice before a neutral magistrate in a public forum.
How to get really xucked over by Uncle Sam
Seems that Uncle Sam has developed a very powerful way to terrorise anyone it doesn't like. There is the very special No Fly list which allows a secret bureaucrat the privilege of just stopping anyone they want from flying with no need for explanation or justification.
The story comes in The Guardian. (if anyone can find it in The Lying Hun , The Australian or some other paper please let me know)
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/23/no-fly-list-operates-in-secret-power-to-exclude
I wonder what it would take to create "reasonable suspicion" about someone you didn't like ? Seems like SFA.
Look on the bright side. It beats being on their Kill List.
Why Voters Don't Trust Hillary Clinton
Debra J. Saunders | Jul 28, 2015
http://townhall.com/columnists/debr...dont-trust-hillary-clinton-n2031130/page/full
Voters in Colorado, Iowa and Virginia think Hillary Clinton is not honest or trustworthy. According to the latest Quinnipiac poll, a mere 34 percent of Colorado voters think she can be trusted; 62 percent do not. In Iowa, those numbers are 33 percent to 59; in Virginia, Clinton is underwater on trust, too, 39 percent to 55 percent.
Clinton's conduct is catching up with her...
Look of course it does.. That is certainly a mercy we can appreciate. Going to a wedding in Afghanistan which turns into a mass funeral has never been top of my wish list.
But an arbitrary no fly list with mistakes, misinformation no redress and the instant categorisation of guilt? Perhaps also not on my list.
I wonder how the Y(w)anks would feel if European nations decided to also set up such a list and managed to include some prominent (w)ankers to show it feels to be just stopped from flying and lose your ticket ?
Be interesting I think..
Clinton is no moral to win, assuming she get's the nomination.
Donald Trumps rabid anti Muslim hype is having its effects. He said that America should simply ban Muslims entering the country. Right now it seems that Homeland security is reinforcing that line by arbitary withdrawal of visa to internationals travellers who are Islamic.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics...rica-refuses-british-muslim-family-disneyland
How to win friends and influence people..the American way.
______________________________________________________________________
With this, and a number of other examples, as precedents why would any person with an Islamic sounding name consider visiting the US for any reason? To run the risk of arbitrary insult and the loss of thousands of dollars of travel costs. Just wrong.
With Obama, at least he was more convincing...
Yeah, like a TV evangelist. Examine the Obama oratory, the techniques are the same.
Donald Trump and the Central Park Five: the racially charged rise of a demagogue
In 1989 five young black men were wrongfully convicted of raping a woman jogging in New York City. Leading the charge against them was a real estate mogul whose divisive rhetoric can be found in his presidential campaign today
Thursday 18 February 2016 05.15 AEDT
Last modified on Thursday 18 February 2016 06.23 AEDT
Yusef Salaam was 15 years old when Donald Trump demanded his execution for a crime he did not commit.
Nearly three decades before the rambunctious billionaire began his run for president – before he called for a ban on Muslims entering the United States, for the expulsion of all undocumented migrants, before he branded Mexicans as “rapists” and was accused of mocking the disabled – Trump called for the reinstatement of the death penalty in New York following a horrific rape case in which five teenagers were wrongly convicted.
The miscarriage of justice is widely remembered as a definitive moment in New York’s fractured race relations. But Trump’s intervention – he signed full-page newspaper advertisements implicitly calling for the boys to die – has been gradually overlooked as the businessman’s chances of winning the Republican nomination have rapidly increased. Now those involved in the case of the so-called Central Park Five and its aftermath say Trump’s rhetoric served as an unlikely precursor to a unique brand of divisive populism that has powered his rise to political prominence in 2016.
BTW bas, do you anything but Pravd.... Errr, The Guardian? Wayne L
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...k-five-donald-trump-jogger-rape-case-new-yorkFollowing a 14-year court battle, the Central Park Five settled a civil case with the city for $41m in 2014. But far from offering an apology for his conduct in 1989, Trump was furious.
In an opinion piece for the New York Daily News, he described the case as the “heist of the century”.
“Settling doesn’t mean innocence, but it indicates incompetence on several levels,” Trump wrote, alluding to how police and prosecutors initially involved in the case have long maintained the five boys were involved in the rape, even after the convictions were thrown out.
D’Antonio, the biographer, met with Trump shortly after the settlement was announced. The billionaire was once again considering a shot at the presidency and would, this time, actually run.
Trump was asked if he worried that his publicly confrontational style would affect his political prospects. He retorted instantly with a reference to the Central Park Five.
“I think it will help me,” he said. “I think people are tired of politically correct. I just attacked the Central Park Five settlement. Who’s going to do that?”
The biographer was shocked by what he heard. “His insensitivity and inability to adjust to reality is sometimes shocking,” D’Antonio said of Trump. “But I don’t think that he is necessarily interested in reality as others experience it or as it’s determined by the courts.
“There have been few cases of injustice that are as clear and profound as this one is, but he’s not able to consider that.”
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