Where is/can Donald Trump take US (sic)?

[wayneL]

John McCain on Trump: suppressing free press is 'how dictators get started'
Despite ‘hating the press’, Republican senator says media is necessary after president calls media ‘the enemy of the American people’



Senator John McCain: ‘I hate the press. But the fact is we need you.’ Photograph: Matthias Schrader/AP

Monday 20 February 2017 01.31 AEDT Last modified on Monday 20 February 2017 04.38 AEDT

Senator John McCain has warned that suppression of a free press is “how dictators get started”, criticizing Donald Trump’s continued declarations that newspapers and news networks are “the enemy of the American people”.

“I hate the press,” McCain told NBC’s Meet the Press in an interview, taped at a security conference with European leaders in Munich.. “But the fact is we need you. We need a free press. We must have it.”

“I’m very serious now, if you want to preserve democracy as we know it, you have to have a free and many times adversarial press,” he continued. “Without it, I am afraid that we would lose so much of our individual liberties over time. That’s how dictators get started.”

The Republican party’s presidential nominee in 2008, McCain has repeatedly criticized Trump’s ideas as a candidate and now as president. The interview, broadcast Sunday, was taped not long after the president tweeted on Friday night that he considered the media “the enemy of the American people”.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...ssing-free-press-is-how-dictators-get-started

What McCain is missing is that free speech had been suppressed for quite some time via ludicrous political correctness.

I would never like to see a legislated silencing of the media, so agree with John on that point.

But I also agree with Trump that the media is no friend of the people and should be called out when appropriate

 

[wayneL]

What positive outcomes have been achieved by these Brexiting, Paulining, Trumpards? The only evidence you have presented thus far is the DOW Jones at a new record high. Although I fail to see what this has to do with Trump. The DOW has hit record highs during most terms of presidency, as it did many times under Obama.

Brexit hasn't actually happened yet, Trump has only just started (and my opinion on that is above) and Pauline has done some good recently in Nth Qld

It's just getting started junior, lots of water to go under the bridge before we see if the plebeian rejection of establishment politics is of benefit.

There will be pain, but I see mostly positives so far.

 

[Logique]

It's sinister, the concerted attack by the left leaning organs of the press, around the world.

They are seriously pissed, they thought they'd groomed Middle America, which saw straight through them, and their golden girl candidate.

Trump is quite right to call them on it.

 

[SirRumpole]

What McCain is missing is that free speech had been suppressed for quite some time via ludicrous political correctness.

Real information has also been supressed by Right Wing propaganda machines in the Murdoch organisation.

 

[SirRumpole]

It's sinister, the concerted attack by the left leaning organs of the press, around the world.

You mean like Murdoch ?

 

[wayneL]

Real information has also been supressed by Right Wing propaganda machines in the Murdoch organisation.

It should be called out no matter what side they're on mate. That tabloid crap is equally irritating, though I wouldn't call newscorp right wing... reeds in the wind

 

[noco]

It should be called out no matter what side they're on mate. That tabloid crap is equally irritating, though I wouldn't call newscorp right wing... reeds in the wind

I have been saying it for years and I will repeat it again.

The first task of socialism is to control the media and that is all a part of the Fabian ideology....Control the media and you control people's minds with lies and propaganda.

The loading of 41% Green and 31% Labor journos in the ABC by that self confessed communist Julia Gillard is a typical example here in Australia and is no doubt going on in the USA originated by Obama.

One would have to be very naive not to have noticed over the years the bias shown towards the Green/Labor socialist coalition....The ABC.....Insiders.....Q&A.....7.30 report....late line ......They all lean heavily to the left.......Turnbull has been so weak with the ABC as he fears the repercussions from the ABC........GETUP is another off shoot of Labor who often stretch the truth.....And not too many know Fabian Bill Shorten is a foundation member and past board member of GETUP.

Donald Trump is awake to the leftist media in the USA and wants to pull them into line but then the lefties put their propaganda machine into action and say it is the start of a dictatorship.

This is socialism working at what it knows best.

 

[Junior]

I like the ABC. They promote tolerance and equality, and denounce racism. Apparently this means I am a 'lefty' according to many in this thread....I've never considered myself to be a lefty before, probably in the centre if I had to use that type of label.

It seems that anyone who dislikes Trump and/or Hanson etc, or does not subscribe to their beliefs and policies is labelled as a 'lefty'. This label seems to be attributed to those who have any kind of empathy for refugees, or would prefer to look after the environment rather than destroy it, for example. I don't understand how these attributes are now seen as negatives by those who call themselves 'right-wing'. Are these not simply beliefs of someone who values kindness and likes to help other people in need, or thinks that maybe we should not pollute ourselves into extinction?

There's this perception that 'leftys' are mad because Trump won. People are upset Trump won because he is a very nasty individual. He is a racist. He promotes and encourages fear. He is proud of his lies. He is narcissistic. He has no political or military experience. These are very dangerous characteristics for the leader of the free world. It's nothing to do with left, right, centre or whatever labels you want to ascribe to people. This man could ruin and destroy millions of lives.....people are worried.

What is a lefty? Noco and WayneL I'd like to hear your definition of the attributes and features of a lefty in 2017. Am I complete wrong in my understanding of this label?

Please avoid wide-ranging and vague labels such as Fabians, Socialists etc. Be more specific.

 

[luutzu]

I like the ABC. They promote tolerance and equality, and denounce racism. Apparently this means I am a 'lefty' according to many in this thread....I've never considered myself to be a lefty before, probably in the centre if I had to use that type of label.

It seems that anyone who dislikes Trump and/or Hanson etc, or does not subscribe to their beliefs and policies is labelled as a 'lefty'. This label seems to be attributed to those who have any kind of empathy for refugees, or would prefer to look after the environment rather than destroy it, for example. I don't understand how these attributes are now seen as negatives by those who call themselves 'right-wing'. Are these not simply beliefs of someone who values kindness and likes to help other people in need, or thinks that maybe we should not pollute ourselves into extinction?

What is a lefty? Noco and WayneL I'd like to hear your definition of the attributes and features of a lefty in 2017. Am I complete wrong in my understanding of this label?

Please avoid wide-ranging and vague labels such as Fabians, Socialists etc. Be more specific.

Saw highlights of Jackie Lambie on Q&A... wow!

Apparently Climate Change is real, now. But we can't do anything about it. So we'll just have to adapt to it.

So get rich, start growing gills, or die because it's your fault for not evolving and adapting fast enough.

And oh, get those kids from gov't housing out of there! Get them out of there!

How Jackie? Just kick them out, show tough love and ways of the world? That'll teach them to grow up and stuff?

A bit unreal.

 

[moXJO]

Real information has also been supressed by Right Wing propaganda machines in the Murdoch organisation.

Murdoch reporters have been very vocal in defending the left leaning media outlets. They are the ones shouting down trump when he attacks left media. Despite the left remaining very quiet when obama attacked free speech of the media when he was first elected and bagging the right.

Murdoch has also been critical of the trump administration in news.com etc. I have not seen many (if any) positive articles on trump.

 

[Tisme]

Murdoch reporters have been very vocal in defending the left leaning media outlets. They are the ones shouting down trump when he attacks left media. Despite the left remaining very quiet when obama attacked free speech of the media when he was first elected and bagging the right.

Murdoch has also been critical of the trump administration in news.com etc. I have not seen many (if any) positive articles on trump.

I see Trump is an avid watcher of Fox news and got himself in a pickle because of it: quoting fictional AndrewBoltesque facts about an incident that never happened in Sweden at all.

 

[noco]

I like the ABC. They promote tolerance and equality, and denounce racism. Apparently this means I am a 'lefty' according to many in this thread....I've never considered myself to be a lefty before, probably in the centre if I had to use that type of label.

It seems that anyone who dislikes Trump and/or Hanson etc, or does not subscribe to their beliefs and policies is labelled as a 'lefty'. This label seems to be attributed to those who have any kind of empathy for refugees, or would prefer to look after the environment rather than destroy it, for example. I don't understand how these attributes are now seen as negatives by those who call themselves 'right-wing'. Are these not simply beliefs of someone who values kindness and likes to help other people in need, or thinks that maybe we should not pollute ourselves into extinction?

There's this perception that 'leftys' are mad because Trump won. People are upset Trump won because he is a very nasty individual. He is a racist. He promotes and encourages fear. He is proud of his lies. He is narcissistic. He has no political or military experience. These are very dangerous characteristics for the leader of the free world. It's nothing to do with left, right, centre or whatever labels you want to ascribe to people. This man could ruin and destroy millions of lives.....people are worried.

What is a lefty? Noco and WayneL I'd like to hear your definition of the attributes and features of a lefty in 2017. Am I complete wrong in my understanding of this label?

Please avoid wide-ranging and vague labels such as Fabians, Socialists etc. Be more specific.

Junior, you ask me to define a "LEFTY" but you put masking tape over my mouth and you tie both of my hands behind my back so now I can't speak or fight back...LOL.

The terms you ask for in that definition restricts me from making a true assessment of a lefty.

Free speech is a wonderful thing until your opponent tries to gag you and that is a well known trait of a lefty.

It seems the branding of Lefties as Fabians and Socialist somehow sticks in their claw as being allied with communism.....If the Green/Labor coalition were to change their name to the Communist Party, I am sure their popularity would go on a downward slide.

So I would find it very difficult to define a LEFTY under your terms and conditions.

I am quite willing to do so if you were to reconsider and lift your terms of reference.

 

[luutzu]

Junior, you ask me to define a "LEFTY" but you put masking tape over my mouth and you tie both of my hands behind my back so now I can't speak or fight back...LOL.

The terms you ask for in that definition restricts me from making a true assessment of a lefty.

Free speech is a wonderful thing until your opponent tries to gag you and that is a well known trait of a lefty.

It seems the branding of Lefties as Fabians and Socialist somehow sticks in their claw as being allied with communism.....If the Green/Labor coalition were to change their name to the Communist Party, I am sure their popularity would go on a downward slide.

So I would find it very difficult to define a LEFTY under your terms and conditions.

I am quite willing to do so if you were to reconsider and lift your terms of reference.

I'll help you out noco.

A lefty is a polite person who also gives a dam about anybody else beside just themselves.

They're the do-gooders who somehow reckon that people's tax dollars ought to be spent on the people instead of it being taken, hand over to rich people and their corporations, then we all blame Muslims and immigrants.

A lefty is someone who reckons imperialism is bad and we ought to leave people alone... that instead of thinking that if them Muslims behave, one day far away, we will find it in our Christian heart to forgive the Muslims for their barbaric religion forcing us to fly over to their countries, wreck the place and not at all take the oil.

A lefty is someone who's horrified at seeing an orange dictatorial loon breaking laws, moral codes, the constitution and civil rights in banning Muslims. That instead of seeing the deep down, the Yellow Emperor is really nice to good, deserving people. That he's only mean to those who deserves it.

 

[Junior]

Junior, you ask me to define a "LEFTY" but you put masking tape over my mouth and you tie both of my hands behind my back so now I can't speak or fight back...LOL.

The terms you ask for in that definition restricts me from making a true assessment of a lefty.

Free speech is a wonderful thing until your opponent tries to gag you and that is a well known trait of a lefty.

It seems the branding of Lefties as Fabians and Socialist somehow sticks in their claw as being allied with communism.....If the Green/Labor coalition were to change their name to the Communist Party, I am sure their popularity would go on a downward slide.

So I would find it very difficult to define a LEFTY under your terms and conditions.

I am quite willing to do so if you were to reconsider and lift your terms of reference.

I am a strong believer in free speech Noco. I've been on this forum for 10 years and have never clicked the report button. So please don't tell me I'm putting masking tape over your mouth. You can say whatever you want.

I'm just baffled by this concept that you are either on Trump's side or you are a LEFTY. I don't understand. That seems very restrictive. As I've alluded to previously the guy reminds me of that tourist advertisement for the Northern Territory (c u in the....), and I think he will halt and reverse the progress of the human race.

 

[Trembling Hand]

and I think he will halt and reverse the progress of the human race.

No fear he is so incompetent he cannot even put together a team to carry out his 'plans' which outside of campaign talking points he hasn't got.

It will be 4 years before he even gets a cabinet room full.

Reality collides with Trump's promises

Trump has appointed just three of the 15 required deputy secretary Cabinet positions; fewer than 40 of the 700 key administration jobs requiring Senate confirmation have been filled.

“There's no precedent in the modern history of the presidency for what we've seen over the last month,” said Republican operative Steve Schmidt. “If you combine the dishonesty, the sloppiness and incompetence, the result is deep concern and anxiety across allied capitals, glee in the capitals of foreign enemies, and an American public that regard him one month in with the lowest levels of support in the modern era. We’ve just never seen an American administration collapse from a credibility perspective as quickly as this one has.

 

[PZ.]

I don't think he'll even be there in four years. Not with the incompetence at this level.

 

[Logique]

I hope Fairfax, the ABC (TV and Radio), the SBS, and yes even the Murdoch press,
take the time to revisit and consider. My bolds. I think there'd be a diversity of opinion on the representation of the Trump Presidency by the above mentioned.

http://www.presscouncil.org.au/charter-of-press-freedom/
A Charter for a Free Press in Australia
The Australian Press Council agreed on the following Charter in 2003 and encouraged other organisations to adopt it.

Preamble
Freedom of opinion and expression is an inalienable right of a free people. Australia is committed to The Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Article 19 of the Declaration provides: "Everyone has the right of freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers".

In a truly democratic society open debate, discussion, criticism and dissent are central to the process of generating informed and considered choices. These processes are crucial to the formation of values and priorities and help in assessing and finding solutions to social, economic and political problems.

A free press is a symbol of a free people. The people of Australia have a right to freedom of information and access to differing opinions and declare that the following principles are basic to an unfettered flow of news and views both within Australia and across the nation's borders.

The Principles
Freedom of the press means the right of the people to be informed by the press on matters of public interest so that they may exercise their rights and duties as citizens.

The press shall not be subject to government licence and government authorities should not interfere with the content of news nor restrict access to any news source.

The press has a responsibility to the public to commit itself to self-regulation which provides a mechanism for dealing with the concerns of members of the public and the maintenance of the ethical standards and journalistic professionalism of the press.

It is in the public interest for the press to make available to the people a wide diversity of views and opinions.

It is the responsibility of the press to protect the people's right to know and to contest encroachments upon that right by governments, groups or individuals.

Laws, regulations and practices which in any way restrict or inhibit the right of the press freely to gather and distribute news, views and information are unacceptable unless it can be shown that the public interest is better served by such laws, regulations or practices than the public interest in the people's right to know.

 

[Tisme]

If it wasn't for lefties we'd still be down the mines at 10 years old and no say in how the nation is run.

Yin and yang

 

[SirRumpole]

If it wasn't for lefties we'd still be down the mines at 10 years old and no say in how the nation is run.

Yin and yang

We also wouldn't have the NBN and NDIS which the LNP are now taking credit for but were never mentioned in the 11 years of the political wilderness called John Howard.

 

[Smurf1976]

JIf the Green/Labor coalition were to change their name to the Communist Party, I am sure their popularity would go on a downward slide.

No doubt it would but then the same would apply if the Coalition changed their name to the Big Business Party, that too would be pretty unpopular.

Actually, they've already tried a rebranding. Where on earth did this "LNP" term come from? It was always "Liberal" or "the Coalition" until not long ago I started seeing this "LNP" term everywhere. Had to stop and think what it meant at first, that it's just the Coalition with a different name and isn't some new party. Presumably some marketing guru thought it would help win a few votes.

None of the majors are doing much good for ordinary Australians in my view.

As for Trump, well I see that Trump jokes are pretty safe territory for comedians these days. Seems a pretty safe way to get a good reaction from the audience by saying something bad about him. If he'd been President for 2 years then maybe that's to be expected, public figures have long been a target of comedy, but I sure don't recall any political leader, of any persuasion, being in that situation just after they've first been elected. Normally takes a while for that sort of thing to happen but not this time.

I'd have more time for Trump if he'd ditch the narcissism and all that comes with it. Been there, seen that crap in another situation and it scares me to have someone in such a powerful position behaving like that. That sort of thing ends badly enough if it's a personal relationship or the boss of a small business but the consequences of the actual President of the USA behaging that way are truly terrifying. It's not some tin pot country with a few palm trees and some nice beaches we're talking about here. The US is the biggest player both financially and militarily which is scary to say the least when you've got someone like Trump calling the shots.