wayneL
VIVA LA LIBERTAD, CARAJO!
- Joined
- 9 July 2004
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I agree it's not hard if you have an understanding of the low level complexity of the system, yet walk down Midland Gate and interview people; how many truly understand or are even remotely interested? I've actually done this and IME it it less than 10%.possibly Wayne but what's hard about numbering 1-7 or 1-12 or 1 above the line to give the party of choice to distribute the preferences as they see fit.
the hard bit is in the tallyingpossibly Wayne but what's hard about numbering 1-7 or 1-12 or 1 above the line to give the party of choice to distribute the preferences as they see fit.
When did I dispute that? I fact I often have pointed out that I'm not a supporter of the current iteration of the Liberals... and I am allowed to be disappointed with the result without disputing it, or not accepting it. I would be equally disappointed with a Liberal win TBH.Albanese won the the election fair and square whether right wing voters accept reality or not. get over it!.
Labor won in a landslide this time, Dutton wasn't a popular choice for opposition leader.
i didn't even like him when he was a low-ranking member in the party when i resided in that electorate .Albanese won the the election fair and square whether right wing voters accept reality or not. get over it!.
Labor won in a landslide this time, Dutton wasn't a popular choice for opposition leader.
Nothing wrong with as you as exercising your vote as you want it to be.the hard bit is in the tallying
somebody ( like me ) will cherry-pick individual candidates and even zig-zag across party lines
i might despise the top ranking and vote him/her absolutely last ( or maybe just last in that party list )
Can't answer that Wayne because in my schooling at Primary School level we were educated in the voting system, so to me its as easy as. Had a couple of school trips to Parliament House in Perth and had a pretty good idea how it worked all those years ago.I agree it's not hard if you have an understanding of the low level complexity of the system, yet walk down Midland Gate and interview people; how many truly understand or are even remotely interested? I've actually done this and IME it it less than 10%.
How much discussion in the media is there on the policies of minor parties, apart from strawmanning their platform?
Who knows the complete platform of any of the minors, or indeed any of the Majors apart from the headline promises ( which are 99% lies anyway)?
But I come back to me original point, most people have NFI.
As the offspring of migrant parents, little was passed onto me regarding the workings of our democracy. Hell, in the strong union movement days and dad being a union member, all he'd say re. elections was something like, "...union members vote labor..."I agree it's not hard if you have an understanding of the low level complexity of the system, yet walk down Midland Gate and interview people; how many truly understand or are even remotely interested? I've actually done this and IME it it less than 10%.
How much discussion in the media is there on the policies of minor parties, apart from strawmanning their platform?
Who knows the complete platform of any of the minors, or indeed any of the Majors apart from the headline promises ( which are 99% lies anyway)?
But I come back to me original point, most people have NFI.
Lucky you! Wished that were true for me in the far west of NSW.Can't answer that Wayne because in my schooling at Primary School level we were educated in the voting system, so to me its as easy as. Had a couple of school trips to Parliament House in Perth and had a pretty good idea how it worked all those years ago.
As the offspring of migrant parents, little was passed onto me regarding the workings of our democracy. Hell, in the strong union movement days and dad being a union member, all he'd say re. elections was something like, "...union members vote labor..."
This is also why the trades are making the kind of money they are - they're a young man's game and young men are reducing in number.It's a problem worldwide and another factor as to why manufacturing will be difficult to ramp up; most of the young do the laborious work, and we're an aging population globally.
Nah, this is deliberate. Kind of like how even the most basic of money skills are no longer taught in school, we used to have classes explaining the systems we lived under and why and how they worked, it was called "civics", and it's now effectively non-existent.UK has a first past the past system and suffered a similar outcome, Labour less than a third and ended up with a massive majority, so I don't think that's the answer.
The great problem with our system is that very few actually understand how it works, basically voting as if it was a first past the post system... ie believing that they may waste their vote if they vote outside of the Majors.
The cause of this is twofold.
1/ the major parties perpetuating this notion.
2/ a complete and utter failure of the AEC to educate the public on how it works.
Also I believe that mandatory voting is both illiberal and forces the politically disengaged to make a decision they have no right to make.
I can't disagree that this is also a factor. I have a young client at uni studying political science (and have had a few of these over the years) and is completely ignorant of these factors.Nah, this is deliberate. Kind of like how even the most basic of money skills are no longer taught in school, we used to have classes explaining the systems we lived under and why and how they worked, it was called "civics", and it's now effectively non-existent.
If she doesn't have some kind of nepotistic ticket into being a special advisor or similiar I'd advise her to drop her degree and do something different. PoliSci or PPE are pure nepotism-track degrees.I can't disagree that this is also a factor. I have a young client at uni studying political science (and have had a few of these over the years) and is completely ignorant of these factors.
I have to be very careful so I don't lose the client but I have completely flummoxed her with some gentle questions along these lines.
I laughed above because you are so spot on and her desired career path is exactly that. She's a lovely girl, I like her, but.... Sheesh!If she doesn't have some kind of nepotistic ticket into being a special advisor or similiar I'd advise her to drop her degree and do something different. PoliSci or PPE are pure nepotism-track degrees.
I can't actually think of a discipline in which competence counts for less.
After reading these current posts of How to Vote, I guess iIwas lucky in that we had a "proper" teacher in those days who thought that learning how to vote and what it meant to vote was very important.Lucky you! Wished that were true for me in the far west of NSW.
I am not that much younger than you and arrived in Australia when I was in grade six, and we had nothing in school along those lines whatsoever.After reading these current posts of How to Vote, I guess iIwas lucky in that we had a "proper" teacher in those days who thought that learning how to vote and what it meant to vote was very important.
We even had "elections" to vote a leader and his/her deputy with primary and preferential votes, and then all gathered around to see how that panned out. Obviously, no classmates' names were on the ballet papers just as it is today.
nope , in high school , the class captain was selected because he was a devout coward ( so most of the class bullied him for 5 years ) i was one of his few friends because i didn't bully him ( despite being labeled the worst bully in the school .. for 4 of those years ) and laughably he about one and a half times my size .. well at least until he starting growing in grade `11 ( and i didn't )We even had "elections" to vote a leader
It wasn't in the school curriculum just this particular teacher was a "real" teacher.I am not that much younger than you and arrived in Australia when I was in grade six, and we had nothing in school along those lines whatsoever.
I had a teacher in social studies who tried to teach us many things about life and law. We were terrified of him but he is the one I remember most as having try to give us such life skills. After all these years, much respect.It wasn't in the school curriculum just this particular teacher was a "real" teacher.
We all leant so much from him.
It was a year of great learning and happiness which still resonates with me today about 65 years on.
In High School In 3rd year we had one of the best teachers ever, who taught Social Studies.I had a teacher in social studies who tried to teach us many things about life and law. We were terrified of him but he is the one I remember most as having try to give us such life skills. After all these years, much respect.
Unfortunately never got on to the voting system.
Such teachers are very rare.In High School In 3rd year we had one of the best teachers ever, who taught Social Studies.
He was a formidable bloke standing about 6'4'', was a ruckman for East Perth for 3 or 4 years before winning a scholarship to the USA.
When he returned he became the Vice Chancellor of Note dame University at Fremantle.
I might add he would stay back at school until 5pm every day, and if we wanted to, he was there for 1.5 hours extra teaching.
Not too many did not take up this offer.
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