The ScoMo Government

[sptrawler]

That's the thing. Money. CFMEU and the Maritime Union merged around 6 months ago and they pull in around $130million a year. For the ALP it's a nice gravy train but also a leash as well.

They spent a truckload of money in Longman from what I've read.

Watch for yet another leadership change if they decide to "short" Shorten as well

Obviously Shorten will get the gig till the election, if Labor loose (which I don't think they will) it will be all down to Shorten, he will be skidded out quicker than Turnbull was that's for sure.

Getting back to Morrison, apparently there is a bit of an uproar about someone having a go at his religous beliefs, that is shaky ground I would have thought.

 

[Purple XS2]

Not many people have attained the office of Prime Minister, having already made their mark on history.

Then cabinet minister Morrison (Treasurer?) waved his piece of coal around, like Gollum caressing his 'Precious': talk about a message to the future: they'll look back on that performance for centuries.

And the punchline to that joke is: "a couple of years later, this person became Prime Minister". I can hear the future laughing already.

Morrison's only hope now is not to leave his mark on history: he's done that alright, in spades; but to re-shape it.
If Morrison has any hope of leading the coalition to victory, he'll need a policy on climate change.
It wouldn't be a pseudo-Green, pro-Paris accord policy: but any policy.
"Every nation for itself", for example. Why not? At least it's a policy.

But Gollum with his Precious?

That's not even stupidity.

 

[moXJO]

That's the thing. Money. CFMEU and the Maritime Union merged around 6 months ago and they pull in around $130million a year. For the ALP it's a nice gravy train but also a leash as well.

They spent a truckload of money in Longman from what I've read.

Watch for yet another leadership change if they decide to "short" Shorten as well

The unions won't get rid of him. He owes big time. Rudd wasn't union backed, but Gillard and Bill are.

Unions are not shy about demanding what they want from elected leaders either.

 

[SirRumpole]

If Morrison has any hope of leading the coalition to victory, he'll need a policy on climate change.
It wouldn't be a pseudo-Green, pro-Paris accord policy: but any policy.
"Every nation for itself", for example. Why not? At least it's a policy.

Both parties face the dichotomy of the electorate over climate change, people want something done about it, as long as it doesn't result in higher bills.

The party than can successfully present both sides of the argument will win. Total denial of CC is a loser, as is over ambitious targets, the middle view is likely to be the winner.

https://theconversation.com/lowy-in...action-at-its-highest-level-in-a-decade-98625

 

[sptrawler]

Both parties face the dichotomy of the electorate over climate change, people want something done about it, as long as it doesn't result in higher bills.

The party than can successfully present both sides of the argument will win. Total denial of CC is a loser, as is over ambitious targets, the middle view is likely to be the winner.

https://theconversation.com/lowy-in...action-at-its-highest-level-in-a-decade-98625

Your call on it is spot on Rumpy, the technology is there to start and move over to renewable energy, the problem is it is in its infancy and will take time to happen.
What people have to accept is, it can't happen quickly without chaos, as you say the parties need to present a sensible goal and an orderly way to achieve it.
At the moment, the real issues are drowned out by white noise.
The winner will be someone who can articulate the issues, and have the media on side to present it correctly, in other words the stars have to line up.

 

[Smurf1976]

Employee, small business owner, small investor, welfare recipients.

The majority of Australian adults would fit into one of those broad categories and my contention is that neither of the two major parties is governing for any of them.

Small business owners and investors might find the Liberals more palatable than Labor but they're seriously kidding themselves is they think the Liberals are actually on their side. Just as employees and welfare recipients may see Labor as better but again, they're fooling themselves if they think the party is really governing for them.

So who are they governing for?

Elites tend to do better out of the Coalition.

Anyone with a somewhat extreme view will likely perceive one party as far better than the other.

Those in specially selected industries will of course receive favourable treatment from one or both parties.

That seems to be about it really.

 

[sptrawler]

What seems to be missing Smurph is a National agenda, a plan, a course of action that gives the people a vision of where they want the Country to go.
They see property prices in Sydney and Melbourne, going through the roof, yet in mining Towns in W.A people are going bankrupt over the drop in house values.
They see adverts on T.V to sponsor the homeless, yet they say the welfare bill is becoming unaffordable.
They see on T.V that there is another skills shortage, I know for a fact that you can't get someone to move to the Goldfields to work on the road. Yet you have no problem finding people in the CBD, with a piece of cardboard begging.
Someone needs to start and be dinkum, and stop the BS, start and tell the media to print it as it is, not as they wish to portray it.
Jeez it sounds like we need a Trump.

 

[Smurf1976]

What people have to accept is, it can't happen quickly without chaos, as you say the parties need to present a sensible goal and an orderly way to achieve it.
At the moment, the real issues are drowned out by white noise.

Your comment reminds me of a very old (1930's) HEC (now Hydro Tas) print advertisement that was run internationally at the time.

So far as the whole energy issue is concerned, all Australian states need to get back to being able to make the claims as per this old advertisement noting that it's not just energy but other infrastructure as well.

As background, the advertisement was run during the Great Depression when the Hydro was looking for private investors to establish manufacturing industries in Tasmania. Any industry would do, so long as it put people into work (and with the implicit assumption that big factories would need a lot of power).

The need to be internationally competitive is something we seem to have forgotten these days in Australia. Failing to do so isn't going to help us in the long term that's for sure.

 

[PZ.]

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fed...un-of-australian-leaders-20180829-p500g7.html

 

[sptrawler]

View attachment 89083

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fed...un-of-australian-leaders-20180829-p500g7.html

I read that PZ99 and the thing it really brought home, was how little these people who write these articles, know about the enormity of the problem. Also how little the posters understand of the enormity of the problem.
If the Government said, o.k we will shut down all coal fired power stations in Australia by 2030, everyone including the media would be rejoicing in the street.
If then they said, the cost of electricity will go up four fold and will be unreliable and unemployment will go to 20% because no business will be viable, they would all stand around in a circle going "say what, you must be $hitting me".
Jeez I would love to see that announcement, a Government say it as it is. lol

 

[sptrawler]

Instead you post up nonsensical cartoons, in the disguise of intelligent comment, the situation is lampooned enough by fools in the media. Without bringing it into our conversation. Just my opinion.

 

[Smurf1976]

I read that PZ99 and the thing it really brought home, was how little these people who write these articles, know about the enormity of the problem.

Having been around it all my adult life I've met very few people who aren't directly involved who are able to comprehend it all.

My conclusion is that humans simply aren't good at anything involving numbers too big to visualise.

Tell someone there's 276 cubic metres of water going through every second and they look sort of puzzled. Point out that's 276,000 litres per second, 16.56 million litres per minute, 996,600,000 litres per hour, every hour, and at that point 90%+ are along the lines of "well if you say so...." meaning they don't really believe it to be true because it just sounds so far beyond anything they can relate to.

All the numbers involved in this stuff are massive compared to anything that 99% of people ever deal with and it is certainly my experience that even highly intelligent and educated people don't immediately grasp it without some serious thought to understand that yes it does all add up and the answers are indeed massive numbers. They understand it only after they've worked through it and can see where these huge numbers come from.

What government needs to do is not baffle people with science or big numbers or misinformation but to have a plan, with properly qualified and experienced people behind it, and explain to the public in layman's terms why it's necessary, the sequence in which things need to happen and with a projected time and cost. Then just get on with it. Put the technical details on a website and hold some information sessions for the few who really want to know the nuts and bolts of it all.

My concern at this point is that the issue is so politicised that nothing will be done under this government and quite possibly the next government, be it either Liberal or Labor, will also avoid the issue. Then we really will be up the creek with no paddle.

 

[SirRumpole]

What government needs to do is not baffle people with science or big numbers or misinformation but to have a plan, with properly qualified and experienced people behind it, and explain to the public in layman's terms why it's necessary, the sequence in which things need to happen and with a projected time and cost. Then just get on with it. Put the technical details on a website and hold some information sessions for the few who really want to know the nuts and bolts of it all.

I was under the impression that the above is why we had the Finkel report.

It could be operating now if the retards in the LNP gave it their support instead of throwing lumps of coal around in Parliament.

 

[PZ.]

Instead you post up nonsensical cartoons, in the disguise of intelligent comment, the situation is lampooned enough by fools in the media. Without bringing it into our conversation. Just my opinion.

It's a pity your self appointed superiority isn't matched by an ability to do it politely, sptrawler.
I didn't write the article, someone else did. The cartoon was relevant to the topic. I don't need your permission to post it.
Your provocation(s) are unnecessary. Don't do it again.

 

[Tisme]

Your comment reminds me of a very old (1930's) HEC (now Hydro Tas) print advertisement that was run internationally at the time.

So far as the whole energy issue is concerned, all Australian states need to get back to being able to make the claims as per this old advertisement noting that it's not just energy but other infrastructure as well.

As background, the advertisement was run during the Great Depression when the Hydro was looking for private investors to establish manufacturing industries in Tasmania. Any industry would do, so long as it put people into work (and with the implicit assumption that big factories would need a lot of power).

The need to be internationally competitive is something we seem to have forgotten these days in Australia. Failing to do so isn't going to help us in the long term that's for sure.

Build it and they will come

 

[SirRumpole]

It's a pity your self appointed superiority isn't matched by an ability to do it politely, sptrawler.
I didn't write the article, someone else did. The cartoon was relevant to the topic. I don't need your permission to post it.
Your provocation(s) are unnecessary. Don't do it again.

More cartoons !

They often sum up a subject much better than words do.

Besides they are usually funnier.

 

[PZ.]

More cartoons !

They often sum up a subject much better than words do.

Besides they are usually funnier.

That was the idea

Both sides of politics want to reduce emissions and have done since the Howard years.
But it's been very costly how the pendulum swung from giving money to a power station for emission reduction versus taking money from a power station to raise funding for renewables.

The Gillard carbon tax was a doozy - it was a broken promise so to appease the public it came with a tax compensation for the end user. Then under Abbott the carbon tax was rolled back - but again to appease the public the tax compensation stayed in place. So we are being compensated for a tax that doesn't even exist. Yet, power prices have become unaffordable.

In my case, the compensation didn't only lower my power costs, it offset them altogether.

Strictly speaking, my power is free.

 

[sptrawler]

It's a pity your self appointed superiority isn't matched by an ability to do it politely, sptrawler.
I didn't write the article, someone else did. The cartoon was relevant to the topic. I don't need your permission to post it.
Your provocation(s) are unnecessary. Don't do it again.

There is no superiority on my part, actually far from it, I try and post only on what I have some understanding of and I thought my comment was very polite considering.
I don't see how lampooning someone who has only just sat down in the job, can be considered intelligent input, I would class it as derogatory innuendo.
You certainly don't need my permission to post whatever you like, but if I feel it is against what I think is fair, I will say so.
As for not doing it again, this isn't a school room and you aren't the teacher, if I wish to do it again I will. This is a forum where people exchange beliefs, ideas and thoughts, if mine don't align with yours, you always have the option of blocking my posts, feel free to do so.

 

[PZ.]

There is no superiority on my part, actually far from it, I try and post only on what I have some understanding of and I thought my comment was very polite considering.
I don't see how lampooning someone who has only just sat down in the job, can be considered intelligent input, I would class it as derogatory innuendo.
You certainly don't need my permission to post whatever you like, but if I feel it is against what I think is fair, I will say so.
As for not doing it again, this isn't a school room and you aren't the teacher, if I wish to do it again I will. This is a forum where people exchange beliefs, ideas and thoughts, if mine don't align with yours, you always have the option of blocking my posts, feel free to do so.

I don't care whether our ideas are aligned or not. If you think it's fair/polite to be condescending to another poster for having a contrary opinion then chances are you will come out looking second best. Got something against cartoons? Free speech?
I didn't lampoon anyone - I even said in another thread I was prepared to give ScoMo a go. Lampooning had zip to do with the article which highlighted a challenge facing the next two Govts in regards to emissions. As for blocking posts - consider that offer reciprocated.

 

[SirRumpole]

The cartoon didn't lampoon Morrison imo, it was just a reminder that he is just the latest to ride over the bones of a political corpse.