Trump Derangement Syndrome

luutzu · 7 August 2018

moXJO said:
Its possible.

So far he always goes for the deal. Its always about the "deal" with trump. He bullies, lies and barges his way towards one. So far he hasn't done too much damage via the military.

Lets see what happens in NK and Iran. He needs to isolate China as they don't care about the sanctions and soak up Irans oil.
He may quit if he loses either house after midterms. Why would you stay and deal with that mess.

At some $700B a year, I'm pretty sure there's plenty of bang for them bucks.

They're getting ready to march into Tehran and Caracas though. That's going to be fun. Jebus man, there's like 7 or 8 wars the US is in right now. Not counting the smaller operations all over Africa and S/America.

Going to add two more. Then possibly in Asia to contain China?

That's how the Poms fell didn't they? Overstretched and taking on the world's rising power.

Saw an interview on the Real News with Paul Jay where he quoted Kissinger, that other Nobel Laureate, saying back in the 1970s that... if there's a smart guy at the US state department 20 years from now, they'll play Russia against China the way Henry is playing China to hold Russia down.

I'm not quite sure how pushing Russia into the arms of China a good way of containing China. Like you said there, Iran's oil will now flow (mostly) to China; Russian oil and gas are already flowing East.

Beijing is probably laughing their buts off right now.

moXJO · 7 August 2018

basilio said:
I thought the BIG deal was a Fox anchor reporter Set Smith systematically rebutting the lies and BS of one of their chief opinion leaders. Very impressive piece of journalism made even better because it came from Fox.

One interesting hypothetical of course is how an identical debunking by a reporter from another network would be treated. Would it be just more "fake news" ? Would also be interesting to see how one eyed Fox viewers felt about Seths analysis. Hint "String him up!!" Check out the comments on the video.

Not sure why fox went all out to the alt right. I'm not sure the center is drifting anymore right either to pick up viewers.
I do like that reporter for the stands he takes and its needed.
Fox needs to drift a bit closer to center rather than run away from it. They need to drop the stories full of half truths as well.

moXJO · 7 August 2018

luutzu said:
At some $700B a year, I'm pretty sure there's plenty of bang for them bucks.

They're getting ready to march into Tehran and Caracas though. That's going to be fun. Jebus man, there's like 7 or 8 wars the US is in right now. Not counting the smaller operations all over Africa and S/America.

Going to add two more. Then possibly in Asia to contain China?

That's how the Poms fell didn't they? Overstretched and taking on the world's rising power.

Saw an interview on the Real News with Paul Jay where he quoted Kissinger, that other Nobel Laureate, saying back in the 1970s that... if there's a smart guy at the US state department 20 years from now, they'll play Russia against China the way Henry is playing China to hold Russia down.

I'm not quite sure how pushing Russia into the arms of China a good way of containing China. Like you said there, Iran's oil will now flow (mostly) to China; Russian oil and gas are already flowing East.

Beijing is probably laughing their buts off right now.

More than likely they will try a people's revolution in Iran. Israel and Saudi Arabia are already firing it up. Sanction bomb and wait for discontent.

The other concern is Turkey. You just don't know where you stand with them.

Obama dropped the ball with Russia and China. Trump is hamstrung at the moment and just as usless untill the collusion details come out. Its a situation that needs urgent sorting as well. Once china is out of the box kiss the US influence goodbye.

luutzu · 7 August 2018

moXJO said:
More than likely they will try a people's revolution in Iran. Israel and Saudi Arabia are already firing it up. Sanction bomb and wait for discontent.

The other concern is Turkey. You just don't know where you stand with them.

Obama dropped the ball with Russia and China. Trump is hamstrung at the moment and just as usless untill the collusion details come out. Its a situation that needs urgent sorting as well. Once china is out of the box kiss the US influence goodbye.

Yea, the nuts in Israel and Saudi Arabia aren't going to let a chance like Trump going away without first lighting Tehran up. It'd be hard to imagine there'll be another US president even thinking about it.

But it's nice to see the Jews and Arabs working together though. Destroying the region and all, but still, it shows that money and geopolitical advantage, and money, is thicker than what edition of the Bible one follows

Heard from some smart guy, and I agree with his analysis (first in best dressed in my greyzone my friend)... he was saying that Obama got it right on China/Russia. That he, or his guys, are better strategist than Trump's warlords, when it come to containing China.

From memory, Putin was still somewhat chummy with Obama... helped him out after that Red Line on Assad where he threatens to send other people's kids boots into Syria if Assad uses chemical weapons. Putin intervened and convinced Assad to get rid of them. But then so much of getting rid of WMD and not being invaded. So maybe Putin was played.

Anyway, Obama did make peace with Iran. Wasn't pushing Russia too hard.. .well, exept Libya and the Ukraine. All that was so the US can withdraw some or most of its resources into Darwin to protect Australia

Then there's that trade pact, TPP, to both make international corporation richer and keeping China out of it.

Trump cleared those in a hurry. So now China have to try and beat the recent $300M upfront payment Pompeo offered tot he ASEAN to flip back to the good side.

It's going to be pretty tough to win friends with that kind of cash man. $300M ain't what they used to be.

That crazy Duterte was saying how the Yanks told him to stand up to China. "with what?", he asked. You know they're building a few military bases right next to window right? They got a lot of people and a whole lot of cash and weapons they're itchy to do some live test with right? [he didn't say that last few bits, but pretty close ]

moXJO · 7 August 2018

luutzu said:
Yea, the nuts in Israel and Saudi Arabia aren't going to let a chance like Trump going away without first lighting Tehran up. It'd be hard to imagine there'll be another US president even thinking about it.

But it's nice to see the Jews and Arabs working together though. Destroying the region and all, but still, it shows that money and geopolitical advantage, and money, is thicker than what edition of the Bible one follows

Heard from some smart guy, and I agree with his analysis (first in best dressed in my greyzone my friend)... he was saying that Obama got it right on China/Russia. That he, or his guys, are better strategist than Trump's warlords, when it come to containing China.

From memory, Putin was still somewhat chummy with Obama... helped him out after that Red Line on Assad where he threatens to send other people's kids boots into Syria if Assad uses chemical weapons. Putin intervened and convinced Assad to get rid of them. But then so much of getting rid of WMD and not being invaded. So maybe Putin was played.

Anyway, Obama did make peace with Iran. Wasn't pushing Russia too hard.. .well, exept Libya and the Ukraine. All that was so the US can withdraw some or most of its resources into Darwin to protect Australia

Then there's that trade pact, TPP, to both make international corporation richer and keeping China out of it.

Trump cleared those in a hurry. So now China have to try and beat the recent $300M upfront payment Pompeo offered tot he ASEAN to flip back to the good side.

It's going to be pretty tough to win friends with that kind of cash man. $300M ain't what they used to be.

That crazy Duterte was saying how the Yanks told him to stand up to China. "with what?", he asked. You know they're building a few military bases right next to window right? They got a lot of people and a whole lot of cash and weapons they're itchy to do some live test with right? [he didn't say that last few bits, but pretty close ]

Putin and Obama hated one another I thought. Obama pivoting east for soft power might have worked. I don't think the military option would.

I think renegotiating the world order from a position of strength. Then westernize/democracy the hell out of them. I think we discussed it before that China won't stay contained for much longer. India is the other one rising.

I'm not sure I have faith in Trump at the negotiating table. The US shoots itself in the feet by constant internal conflict.

But the next decade Australia will have to decide if we are east or west. We should be strengthening ties in asia a lot more then we have been.

Tisme · 7 August 2018

SirRumpole said:
Bas and Tisme harmonious ?

Maybe that's a troll post itself.

He's been using bas as his foil during the whole troll campaign. The "hilarious" statements etc are classic troll methods to flame, then the icing on the cake is to complain to the admin about the mess created by the troll itself ...... not very sophisticated, lame really and now we all know for sure he's not bas' husband afterall.

luutzu · 7 August 2018

moXJO said:
Putin and Obama hated one another I thought. Obama pivoting east for soft power might have worked. I don't think the military option would.

I think renegotiating the world order from a position of strength. Then westernize/democracy the hell out of them. I think we discussed it before that China won't stay contained for much longer. India is the other one rising.

I'm not sure I have faith in Trump at the negotiating table. The US shoots itself in the feet by constant internal conflict.

But the next decade Australia will have to decide if we are east or west. We should be strengthening ties in asia a lot more then we have been.

Heard that Putin said during the Obama/[that Bain Capital Mormon guy... Romney?] that he's vote for Obama.

But yea, I can't remember whether they started off as bff or not. But it didn't end on happy terms sometime after the US and NATO bombed Libya, then a "democratic" uprising in the Ukraine.

Yea, don't think it's possible to contain China. I mean, both sides have nukes so they'll, hopefully, not directly confront each other. So that leave a few well funded CIA ops in the Middle Kingdom lighting up that cry for freedom, democracy and a civil war or two.

If that happens... quite a few million Chinese will not live their natural life. Australia and most of the world's economy will be stuffed.

Would China just sit there and take it or will they open a few Facebook pages to get back at the US?

The other alternative is to just let them alone. Watch their own imperial ambition pizzes every one of their neighbours off and then send over a few pallets of the good stuff to help things along.

Oh man, I just realised it might not be normal to talk war and peace like this... It's not psychotic if you're just "intellectualising" it right?

Anywa, soft power and foreign aid.

China probably have an upper hand on that one already. They managed to pull Pakistan their way right under the US's nose. All those hundreds of millions of aids from the US, the nuclear code to fend against India.

I guess droning them doesn't help the friendship. Building a few freight rail and highways and ports helps a lot.

------

Australia should do alright. One master is the same as another. And it's always good to know more than two language anyway.

basilio · 7 August 2018

Tisme said:
He's been using bas as his foil during the whole troll campaign. The "hilarious" statements etc are classic troll methods to flame, then the icing on the cake is to complain to the admin about the mess created by the troll itself ...... not very sophisticated, lame really and now we all know for sure he's not bas' husband afterall.

Shirley your not serious!! Darc and I still good friends - thats all. Nothing else..

Unlike you and I "12C" Tizzie.. we understand each other so well. All your little dark secrets. Those amazing stories you float ... but don't necessarily believe? Your creative ways with pontification.

And of course who could be a more accomplished troller than Tizzie? Let's be fair he is up there with the best.

moXJO · 7 August 2018

basilio said:
.

And of course who could be a more accomplished troller than Tizzie? Let's be fair he is up there with the best.

But I'm the best right?

moXJO · 7 August 2018

luutzu said:
Heard that Putin said during the Obama/[that Bain Capital Mormon guy... Romney?] that he's vote for Obama.

But yea, I can't remember whether they started off as bff or not. But it didn't end on happy terms sometime after the US and NATO bombed Libya, then a "democratic" uprising in the Ukraine.

Yea, don't think it's possible to contain China. I mean, both sides have nukes so they'll, hopefully, not directly confront each other. So that leave a few well funded CIA ops in the Middle Kingdom lighting up that cry for freedom, democracy and a civil war or two.

If that happens... quite a few million Chinese will not live their natural life. Australia and most of the world's economy will be stuffed.

Would China just sit there and take it or will they open a few Facebook pages to get back at the US?

The other alternative is to just let them alone. Watch their own imperial ambition pizzes every one of their neighbours off and then send over a few pallets of the good stuff to help things along.

Oh man, I just realised it might not be normal to talk war and peace like this... It's not psychotic if you're just "intellectualising" it right?

Anywa, soft power and foreign aid.

China probably have an upper hand on that one already. They managed to pull Pakistan their way right under the US's nose. All those hundreds of millions of aids from the US, the nuclear code to fend against India.

I guess droning them doesn't help the friendship. Building a few freight rail and highways and ports helps a lot.

------

Australia should do alright. One master is the same as another. And it's always good to know more than two language anyway.

I'm actually worried australia is screwed and due for an economic fall either way. Trump sanctions will eventually filter down the line and screw us. Petrol prices are already getting high (partly US dollar)but the Iran stuff will eventually bite us harder. And a drought so food will move up. No energy plan. The cards are stacking against us.

Tisme · 8 August 2018

basilio said:
Shirley your not serious!! Darc and I still good friends - thats all. Nothing else..

Unlike you and I "12C" Tizzie.. we understand each other so well. All your little dark secrets. Those amazing stories you float ... but don't necessarily believe? Your creative ways with pontification.

And of course who could be a more accomplished troller than Tizzie? Let's be fair he is up there with the best.

Listen lady, I am not going to apologise for living a full and worthwhile life, just because you decided somewhere in yours, to live a beige boring tit, safe puritanical existence.

You have to learn to own your own short comings instead of being part of the takedown brigade. Beginning by stopping the deliberate lying would be a good start for you.

Luv 12CTizzie

Tisme · 8 August 2018

moXJO said:
But I'm the best right?

So ...it's come to that has it! All that pillow talk was for nought it seems.

SirRumpole · 8 August 2018

moXJO said:
I'm actually worried australia is screwed and due for an economic fall either way. Trump sanctions will eventually filter down the line and screw us. Petrol prices are already getting high (partly US dollar)but the Iran stuff will eventually bite us harder. And a drought so food will move up. No energy plan. The cards are stacking against us.

Yes, I agree.

If Trump insists that people who trade with Iran won't trade with the US, then that's going to put a big hole in our wheat exports. Trumps arrogance has collateral damage yet again.

Tisme · 8 August 2018

SirRumpole said:
Yes, I agree.

If Trump insists that people who trade with Iran won't trade with the US, then that's going to put a big hole in our wheat exports. Trumps arrogance has collateral damage yet again.

Not really knowing the answer, but I wonder how his edicts have benefitted or disadvantaged Oz sofar?

SirRumpole · 8 August 2018

Tisme said:
Not really knowing the answer, but I wonder how his edicts have benefitted or disadvantaged Oz sofar?

I'd say sanctions to date mean we have sold a lot less to Iran than we otherwise could have, so our income has been reduced, but like you I wouldn't guess by how much.

Tisme · 8 August 2018

SirRumpole said:
I'd say sanctions to date mean we have sold a lot less to Iran than we otherwise could have, so our income has been reduced, but like you I wouldn't guess by how much.

My crystal ball suggests it's the usual riding on the sheep's back stuff from us = wheat, wool and animal cruelty (live sheep exports). Can't be much in the scheme of things.

I doubt we have anything else to offer given we don't really make anything except collectivist rules and nanny states.

SirRumpole · 8 August 2018

Tisme said:
I doubt we have anything else to offer given we don't really make anything except collectivist rules and nanny states.

Have a look in the Energy thread.

If we can patent our method of hydrogen storage and transport, that could be our oilfields.

Tisme · 8 August 2018

SirRumpole said:
Have a look in the Energy thread.

If we can patent our method of hydrogen storage and transport, that could be our oilfields.

Yeah I read that when you posted it. Fingers crossed on that, but I think it will be sold off and any production done in another country ... that's how we do it here isn't it...e.g. develop solar cells and run off to mother country with the technology and knowhow or sell to overseas mob who will kill the idea for profit.

basilio · 8 August 2018

Tisme said:
Listen lady, I am not going to apologise for living a full and worthwhile life, just because you decided somewhere in yours, to live a beige boring tit, safe puritanical existence.

You have to learn to own your own short comings instead of being part of the takedown brigade. Beginning by stopping the deliberate lying would be a good start for you.

Luv 12CTizzie

Brilliant troll Up there with the best of your work 12C Tizzie. Delighted to see you havn't lost your stiletto.

Truly what we do without the blessed stories of your full and wonderful life and infinite capacity to justify whatever story you drop in our laps.

Skate · 8 August 2018

Tisme said:
Listen lady, I am not going to apologise for living a full and worthwhile life, just because you decided somewhere in yours, to live a beige boring tit, safe puritanical existence.

You have to learn to own your own short comings instead of being part of the takedown brigade. Beginning by stopping the deliberate lying would be a good start for you.

Luv 12CTizzie

OFF TOPIC Observation

"to live a beige boring tit, safe puritanical existence".

Tisme is very articulate when posting but this vernacular prompted a chuckle..

Skate.

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