Trading the SPI

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

wayneL said:
Battman,

After nearly 4000 posts in this thread, we still have not ascertained what IS Gann.

But as a matter of fact, other methods have been discussed e.g.

Floor traders pivots, including calcs.

Frank D has posted some material

Ageo's MA crossover method

etc etc etc

Please!!! Enough with the red herrings!!!

i agree whole heartedly wayne.

i have spoken privately to a number of ASF members who are aware of the size in both the futures market and cash market i trade, and who I was before i started trading PA..bronte, i looked at the number of sales that trade at 5295 the other day and 7 lots traded there, so even if you were all seven lots, you hardly have a massive book. I wish everyone on here could make money, inlcuding you bronte, but as we all know, 90% of PA futures traders loose 100% of there capital in the first 30 days.

If anyone wishes to discuss my methodologies, which I have always been open about (again ill state that i trade the CASH market V the SPI), I am more than willing to do so. I believe (and i could be very wrong) I am the only trader on ASF who used to do this professionally as well, and those connections still exist....my point...bronte, i think you or whatever it is need some english lessons. when a question is asked of you, it would help your reputation (if you care) no end to just answer them directly, straight out. I for one would start listening to your calls if you answered questions.

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

Bronte said:
'Trading the SPI'
- over 90 per cent of futures trades lose! Brent Penfold

This thread is about 'Trading the SPI'
Hopefully someone can show us another method.
That is not Gann.

ill show a method that is not gann..no problems.

I trade the spread between the CASH and the SPI. When it widens, I sell futures and buy stock, when the spread contracts, I buy the futures and sell the stock (not sometimes vice versa).

Bronte · 13 October 2006

Did you not say?
"You have tried hundreds of ways to trade the SPI...
you now have to find one that makes money"

Bronte · 13 October 2006

spitrader1 said:
ill show a method that is not gann..no problems.

Looking forward to seeing this....good luck.
(Please try and keep him honest Wayne)

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

Bronte said:
Did you not say?
"You have tried hundreds of ways to trade the SPI...
you now have to find one that makes money"

that was a qoute i liked from another forum, not something that specificlly happened to me.

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

Bronte said:
Looking forward to seeing this....good luck.
(Please try and keep him honest Wayne)

did u not read the rest of the post??

sails · 13 October 2006

spitrader1 said:
i agree whole heartedly wayne.

i have spoken privately to a number of ASF members who are aware of the size in both the futures market and cash market i trade, and who I was before i started trading PA..bronte, i looked at the number of sales that trade at 5295 the other day and 7 lots traded there, so even if you were all seven lots, you hardly have a massive book. I wish everyone on here could make money, inlcuding you bronte, but as we all know, 90% of PA futures traders loose 100% of there capital in the first 30 days.

If anyone wishes to discuss my methodologies, which I have always been open about (again ill state that i trade the CASH market V the SPI), I am more than willing to do so. I believe (and i could be very wrong) I am the only trader on ASF who used to do this professionally as well, and those connections still exist....my point...bronte, i think you or whatever it is need some english lessons. when a question is asked of you, it would help your reputation (if you care) no end to just answer them directly, straight out. I for one would start listening to your calls if you answered questions.

Hi spitrader1,

My interest in this thread is that I started trading some years ago learning Gann methods on the SPI - was brand new to trading and hadn't heard of any other methods at that time. I did not complete their course due to the huge price tag so I only got the basics anyway. Even though I eventually learned other methods, still only got mediocre results on the SPI so it simply wasn't worth the risk.

To me, Gann is simply "another method" available to us retail traders, however some seem to be able to make it work better than others.

If I could find a good method to trade the SPI, I would open an account again in a heartbeat. Don't like to be beaten, but had to admit defeat on the SPI some time ago now.

Would really like to learn more about your methods too, but as a professional trader, do you have access to information that is not available to the average retail trader?

My understanding is that the retail trader only has technical or fundamental analysis to use (and so has to become good at it to succeed plus money management, etc) whereas professional traders have access to order flow and perhaps other info not available to us.

Cheers,

Margaret.

PS I also have more questions on options for you - but will use the appropriate thread!

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

sails said:
Hi spitrader1,

My interest in this thread is that I started trading some years ago learning Gann methods on the SPI - was brand new to trading and hadn't heard of any other methods at that time. I did not complete their course due to the huge price tag so I only got the basics anyway. Even though I eventually learned other methods, still only got mediocre results on the SPI so it simply wasn't worth the risk.

To me, Gann is simply "another method" available to us retail traders, however some seem to be able to make it work better than others.

If I could find a good method to trade the SPI, I would open an account again in a heartbeat. Don't like to be beaten, but had to admit defeat on the SPI some time ago now.

Would really like to learn more about your methods too, but as a professional trader, do you have access to information that is not available to the average retail trader?

My understanding is that the retail trader only has technical or fundamental analysis to use (and so has to become good at it to succeed plus money management, etc) whereas professional traders have access to order flow and perhaps other info not available to us.

Cheers,

Margaret.

PS I also have more questions on options for you - but will use the appropriate thread!

i used to be a proffessional trader sails, I am now a PA trader just like 99% of the ASF members..I would be more than happy to answer options questions as well.

Bobby · 13 October 2006

Bronte said:
Looking forward to seeing this....good luck.
(Please try and keep him honest Wayne)

Just curious as to what is the easier way to make money.

1. Selling information
2. real trading

Gann was still selling information as an old man

Have Fun
Bob.

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

Bobby said:
Just curious as to what is the easier way to make money.

1. Selling information
2. real trading

Gann was still selling information as an old man

Have Fun
Bob.

good point bobby...even on brent penfolds site he is very honest that even if you subscibe to him, dont expect riches, expect a decnt return, but dont think u are going to turn 10k into 100k in three months. At the end of the day the theory is correct that if you invent a system that really, really works and doesnt require size capital to trade, then you arent going to sell it!!

sails · 13 October 2006

spitrader1 said:
i used to be a proffessional trader sails, I am now a PA trader just like 99% of the ASF members..I would be more than happy to answer options questions as well.

Thanks for that info, spitrader1. While I'm not advocating T/A or F/A, however, without the professional training and mentoring that you guys probably get, unfortunately technicals/fundamentals and the like is all that's available for the retail trader.

I would find it most interesting to see how a trader with professional experience goes about it. Always happy to learn something new...

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

sails said:
Thanks for that info, spitrader1. While I'm not advocating T/A or F/A, however, without the professional training and mentoring that you guys probably get, unfortunately technicals/fundamentals and the like is all that's available for the retail trader.

I would find it most interesting to see how a trader with professional experience goes about it. Always happy to learn something new...

as am I sails. My main objective with trading the SPI is to learn something new every day, its not to make money. That way when I profit, its a nice little surprise to an educational trip that has been ongoing for the best part of 15 years.

Magdoran · 13 October 2006

sails said:
Hi Mag,

I would also love to know exactly how Bronte and Battman get their daily support and resistance on the SPI! However, agree with you that their reluctance to spell it out could be that they feel it is their Intellectual Property.

Likewise, I was disappointed a few months back when you declined to give more info on your option diagonals, but respectfully accepted your decision and your right to do so. So even asking nicely won't help if it's IP!!

B&B say they have been doing this for quite a number of years now so it's quite possible, as you say, that they may have developed their own tweaks of numerous Gann methods available.

I must say though, that the different view points over this thead are really quite amusing in their extremes - there are those that ridicule Gann methods as hocus pocus or absolute nonsense. OTOH, we have those who want to know exactly how they do it - perhaps (like me) they have seen "proof of the pudding" over time - otherwise they wouldn't be interested in the methods used.

Anyway, agree with your view point which would be in the spirit of ASF, that as much as many of us would like to find out, we can still be respectful to the rights of other posters and their IP

Regards,

Margaret.

Hello Margaret,

How are you? Hope you’re enjoying the sunshine up there! (very hot yesterday here – they even made it a total fire ban!).

I tend to agree with your viewpoint here about being respectful of other posters. I do have concerns about ramping, misguiding, or spruiking. In B&B’s situation I don’t see them doing any of these things, so I’m happy to just watch this thread from time to time to see what the daily perception is here. Although I do note the joint moderator’s concerns about the potential for hindsight trading.

Regards

Magdoran

P.S. Oh, I didn’t think that I declined to talk about option diagonals (indeed I thought my PM response gave you some ideas of what I was doing), it was more the complexity involved in getting such an advanced idea over in this kind of forum (although there is some IP I would prefer some players – particularly market makers - not know about). There are so many different aspects to it, and all of them are an art in themselves, and I’ve fused them all together…

Part of the complexity stems from using pattern based time and price points in T/A terms, in tandem with the morphing of OTM positions using diagonal approaches. Add to this playing the market makers strategy.

The difficulty in dealing with these strategies in the forums is that they are not static approaches. I have difficulty getting the message over even when dealing with people face to face despite access to software and a whiteboard. Either the T/A stumps them, or the options logic, or both… (I’m not saying you wouldn’t be savvy enough Margaret, I’m sure you’d find holes in my thinking!).

Bobby · 13 October 2006

spitrader1 said:
good point bobby...even on brent penfolds site he is very honest that even if you subscibe to him, dont expect riches, expect a decnt return, but dont think u are going to turn 10k into 100k in three months. At the end of the day the theory is correct that if you invent a system that really, really works and doesnt require size capital to trade, then you arent going to sell it!!

Thanks Spitrader,

Yep , no one going to sell a system that works well !

Second-rate mediocrity with nebulous significance abounds , just pay up & say abracadabra :

professor_frink · 13 October 2006

Bobby said:
Thanks Spitrader,

Yep , no one going to sell a system that works well !

Second-rate mediocrity with nebulous significance abounds , just pay up & say abracadabra :

I have a great system for sale if anyone wants it, but you need a time machine to go back in time 10 minutes to take the signals.

Only $49.95(time machine not included)

Send cash to

P.Frink
c/o Aussie Stock Forums,
The Internet.

professor_frink · 13 October 2006

Bronte said:
Looking forward to seeing this....good luck.
(Please try and keep him honest Wayne)

Can you explain that for me please bronte?

Why does spitrader1 need to be kept honest?

I've haven't seen him be anything but honest on the forum.

spitrader1 · 13 October 2006

professor_frink said:
I have a great system for sale if anyone wants it, but you need a time machine to go back in time 10 minutes to take the signals.

Only $49.95(time machine not included)

Send cash to

P.Frink
c/o Aussie Stock Forums,
The Internet.

as do i professor..

only 9.95 a month, please send all cheques to
Harry Hindsight
151 Two minutes ago street
Yesterday
Post code Previously.

Bobby · 13 October 2006

professor_frink said:
I have a great system for sale if anyone wants it, but you need a time machine to go back in time 10 minutes to take the signals.

Only $49.95(time machine not included)

Send cash to

P.Frink
c/o Aussie Stock Forums,
The Internet.

Very tempting Professor, maybe we could combine it with my unreal system based on the teaching of that late great trader Dr B.S. Pukcuf.

Infact I'll let the Pukcuf system go for a free this month which is a real steal

Euler · 13 October 2006

Euler said:
... I still have no connction to my main machine .... (

I promise to not post any more about my internet connection problem ... but in case it helps anyone ... my last effort this morning was to connect 2nd pc directly to the router (via ethernet cable) ... and guess what ... no connection! ... this led me to think the ethernet cable was shorted out when the power failure. Not having a spare, took the pc to my guru to have it checked. Diagnosis was A1! ... connected and worked perfectly on his network ... so guess what? ... he said ... "it has to be the cable. Here's a spare @ $12.50!" Took it all home, hooked it up with the new cable and ... bingo!! .. connected again!!

Now the hard work start to catch up on the last 48hrs ... thanks guys for your thoughts ... even if it was "I wish he'd take this elsewhere!" ..

swingstar · 13 October 2006

Euler said:
I promise to not post any more about my internet connection problem ... but in case it helps anyone ... my last effort this morning was to connect 2nd pc directly to the router (via ethernet cable) ... and guess what ... no connection! ... this led me to think the ethernet cable was shorted out when the power failure. Not having a spare, took the pc to my guru to have it checked. Diagnosis was A1! ... connected and worked perfectly on his network ... so guess what? ... he said ... "it has to be the cable. Here's a spare @ $12.50!" Took it all home, hooked it up with the new cable and ... bingo!! .. connected again!!

Thanks for reminding me that my time spent in I.T. and at uni wasn't a complete waste of time.

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