Scams, whose fault?

[farmerge]

This is a brilliant story. Please take the time to check it out.

The headline is a 73 year old pensioner taking NAB to court and suing them for $379m (You have read the story just to follow the logic of his claim. Very cool)

The big points are the exposure of yet another very sophisticated fraud process which is sweeping the world. But overall appreciate the sheer balls of Ian Williams to take on NAB, review humongous files of legal precedents and then represent himself at the Supreme Court.

This has all the makings of great movie.

Pensioner takes NAB to Supreme Court over $1,338 in fraudulent transactions​

By Rachel Clayton

8h ago8 hours ago
View attachment 203786
Ian WIlliams is taking his battle against NAB to the Supreme Court. (ABC News: Rachel Clayton)

Link copied

It was a cool, grey spring morning in 2022 when Ian Williams woke up and discovered two transactions on his account he did not make.
"I was sitting on the toilet and checking through my bank account, as you do," he said.

One was for $515, the other was $823. They had been made a few days earlier at a Coles supermarket in Bundoora, about 150 kilometres from his regional Victorian home in Bendigo.

He called the bank and was told to wait while staff investigated.
https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/backgroundbriefing/
Two hours later, he said, a customer service representative from uBank, a subsidiary of National Australia Bank (NAB), called him back and said that, according to the bank's payment data, the transactions were made using Williams's Google Pay account.

"They said that I was guilty, I was responsible, I was personally at Coles to do the transactions with my phone and my thumbprint."

That was an accusation he would never let go.

Two and half years later, Williams was outside the Supreme Court in Melbourne.

He'd just learnt he could be in line to win more than $300 million in his case against the bank over the fraud.
After months of scrolling through codes, acts, and case law to represent himself in the most David and Goliath of cases, the bank hadn't shown up at court, and a judge had found in his favour.

Pensioner robbed of $1,338 is taking NAB to court for millions

Ian Williams wakes up one morning to find $1,338 has been stolen from his account via two Google Pay transactions. Two years later, he's taking on NAB at the Supreme Court, with no lawyers to help him.

www.abc.net.au

I read about Mr Ian Williams earlier. just brilliant stuff.
On the same page as the Post Office scandal in the UK where the man in the street has taken on the behemoth institution.
It is to be hoped Mr Williams will have the Judge find in his favour.

 

[basilio]

Another sophisticated scam this time involving cloned scam websites that turn up on the sponsored list of Google.

Long story but again very troubling.

New Chinese criminal software 'Darcula' tricking consumers into falling for fake websites​

By Rachel Clayton

• Background Briefing
• Topic:Scams and Fraud

13h ago13 hours ago

Peter Davis's bank would not pay back a fraudulent charge after he was scammed. (ABC News: Jack Fisher)

Link copied

Peter Davis was unwinding with friends and red wine on a Friday evening in October last year when everyone got hungry.
"We soon started to think about pizza," he said.
The 55-year-old looked up his favourite pizza joint — Crust Pizza — via Google and clicked on the first result, which happened to be a sponsored result.

The site Peter Davis visited could have been created by sophisticated phishing software Darcula. (ABC News: Jack Fisher)
He logged into his Crust account and the site showed him he had earned a free pizza for his loyalty.
Mr Davis ordered two pizzas for about $25.

"I entered my VISA debit card details and clicked pay. The animated wheel, representing that the transaction is processing, was doing its thing and continued for what seemed too long," he said

It took so long that he thought the transaction would time out and he would have to do it all over again.

"At that moment, my ANZ bank app sprang to life and notified me of a transaction to authorise," he said.
He quickly clicked on the app and approved the transaction.

But the payment processing wheel kept spinning on the website.
Another notification from his ANZ app told him his payment had gone through.
Except it was a payment of $570.93 and it had gone to a business called Soax Ltd London.

"Realisation was dawning and I started to freak out," he said.

New DIY software allows criminals to clone any website

Sophisticated subscription services that use multiple languages and can mimic legitimate brands are being used by criminals to trick consumers into visiting fake websites.

www.abc.net.au

 

[farmerge]

Another sophisticated scam this time involving cloned scam websites that turn up on the sponsored list of Google.

Long story but again very troubling.

New Chinese criminal software 'Darcula' tricking consumers into falling for fake websites​

By Rachel Clayton

• Background Briefing
• Topic:Scams and Fraud

13h ago13 hours ago
View attachment 204010
Peter Davis's bank would not pay back a fraudulent charge after he was scammed. (ABC News: Jack Fisher)

Link copied

Peter Davis was unwinding with friends and red wine on a Friday evening in October last year when everyone got hungry.
"We soon started to think about pizza," he said.
The 55-year-old looked up his favourite pizza joint — Crust Pizza — via Google and clicked on the first result, which happened to be a sponsored result.
View attachment 204011
The site Peter Davis visited could have been created by sophisticated phishing software Darcula. (ABC News: Jack Fisher)
He logged into his Crust account and the site showed him he had earned a free pizza for his loyalty.
Mr Davis ordered two pizzas for about $25.

It took so long that he thought the transaction would time out and he would have to do it all over again.

"At that moment, my ANZ bank app sprang to life and notified me of a transaction to authorise," he said.
He quickly clicked on the app and approved the transaction.

But the payment processing wheel kept spinning on the website.
Another notification from his ANZ app told him his payment had gone through.
Except it was a payment of $570.93 and it had gone to a business called Soax Ltd London.

New DIY software allows criminals to clone any website

Sophisticated subscription services that use multiple languages and can mimic legitimate brands are being used by criminals to trick consumers into visiting fake websites.

www.abc.net.au

Had he taken notice of the first notification from his bank then this sad tale might not have eventuated.

 

[The Triangle]

Had he taken notice of the first notification from his bank then this sad tale might not have eventuated.

When these modern payment approvals pop up on your phone and say do you approve this purchase for $xxx dollars that is your opportunity to go hey wait a minute this isn't right. If it was visa it wouldn't have said $25 it would have said $570 is the approval about. Maybe something has changed but my approval apps tell me how much I'm approving.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

you have to pay attention all the time.

trust is out the window

 

[Bellcose]

I don't know the cause but over the last few days I have received a number of emails and texts stating I have won a prize, a package is waiting and other stupid issues. These seem to be increasing lately.

It's very annoying but apart from deleting them, there is little I can do to stop them. Yelling at the ISP or telco achieves nothing so I don't bother.

As for the banks, I was once actually logged in to my account and transferred a few hundred dollars to one of my others accounts and the bank blocked the transaction. It was the first time I had done that with this account and the bank's system identified it as a suspicious transaction.

Took around an hour to sort it out and I was given the spiel about scams and all that. Once the bank went OK it's gone through I was required to reset my password for access and also reinstall the bank app (which I only use to see the available balance. I never use the app for transactions.)

 

[Bellcose]

Peter Davis was unwinding with friends and red wine on a Friday evening in October last year when everyone got hungry.

The words I have put in bold may have also been a factor. Only a possibility not a certainty.

 

[farmerge]

I don't know the cause but over the last few days I have received a number of emails and texts stating I have won a prize, a package is waiting and other stupid issues. These seem to be increasing lately.

It's very annoying but apart from deleting them, there is little I can do to stop them. Yelling at the ISP or telco achieves nothing so I don't bother.

As for the banks, I was once actually logged in to my account and transferred a few hundred dollars to one of my others accounts and the bank blocked the transaction. It was the first time I had done that with this account and the bank's system identified it as a suspicious transaction.

Took around an hour to sort it out and I was given the spiel about scams and all that. Once the bank went OK it's gone through I was required to reset my password for access and also reinstall the bank app (which I only use to see the available balance. I never use the app for transactions.)

When it comes to mobile phones in my household (we have one each) that is exactly what it is just a phone, no banking and nothing of any importance is it used for.
Either computer or counter service only for banking.
But nothing is safe these days.
We too have had the bank contact us about various transactions, which to me shows they are on the ball.

 

[farmerge]

The parcel is waiting for you pick it up, but unfortunately we don't have a post code. Click on the link to be able to get your delivery.
This Scam has been a bit quite for us in recent times, but we have had a few in the last week or so.
Next will the ATO with a refund of sorts, I guess.
No doubt some suckers will be sucked in and have their accounts drained dry, because of their stupidity.

 

[Bellcose]

I don't profess to have the answers. Although scams have always occurred, the increasing use of technology has made the scams easier but maybe because we are generally slow learners and never fully believe we can be scammed, as a group we are not as careful as we should be.

And if impediments are put in our way to access our funds or to buy what we wish, we complain yet if money is lost it is somebody else's or some financial institution which is at fault.

 

[farmerge]

I don't profess to have the answers. Although scams have always occurred, the increasing use of technology has made the scams easier but maybe because we are generally slow learners and never fully believe we can be scammed, as a group we are not as careful as we should be.

And if impediments are put in our way to access our funds or to buy what we wish, we complain yet if money is lost it is somebody else's or some financial institution which is at fault.

@Bellcose I generally believe that if one takes just reasonable care and not just pushing buttons because that is what one is being informed to do, then half of the battle in won.
It is always a fool, and their money will nearly always part company.

 

[basilio]

@Bellcose I generally believe that if one takes just reasonable care and not just pushing buttons because that is what one is being informed to do, then half of the battle in won.
It is always a fool, and their money will nearly always part company.

I don't know FM. Really and truly. Yes it sounds all very good to "be careful" "not push buttons" and so on. The facts are that phishing scams, copying scams and sheer creative story telling scamming are all getting better. And honestly we are not always at the top of our game. That is just life.

I post information on these scams regularly. I am particularly concerned when some new twist comes up which suggest a more sophisticated approach or an easier path to infiltrating our accounts/identities etcetera.

My personal experience has been watching friends and family being tricked and doing what I can to assist.

On an overall perspective I suggest our older adge bracket is very vulnerable and a good target. There is generally more money in our accounts. Overall IT savey is possibly lower than younger people. Maybe..

 

[farmerge]

I don't know FM. Really and truly. Yes it sounds all very good to "be careful" "not push buttons" and so on. The facts are that phishing scams, copying scams and sheer creative story telling scamming are all getting better. And honestly we are not always at the top of our game. That is just life.

I post information on these scams regularly. I am particularly concerned when some new twist comes up which suggest a more sophisticated approach or an easier path to infiltrating our accounts/identities etcetera.

My personal experience has been watching friends and family being tricked and doing what I can to assist.

On an overall perspective I suggest our older adge bracket is very vulnerable and a good target. There is generally more money in our accounts. Overall IT savey is possibly lower than younger people. Maybe..

@basilio Me and She, both being at an age where IT and the like sails way overhead, we practice extreme caution and due diligence when it comes to texts, e-mails and the like. Just about 100% of text messages are deleted as scams, e-mails not known to us are rejected as scams, phone calls, unless that has a name tied to it is deemed to be a scam, unless a message is left and even then it is treated with extreme caution.
Running a rural business as we do, we get plenty of all of it, but so far have been fortunate to not have had any problems.