Myers-Briggs personality type

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

numbercruncher said:

The entire concept of Introvert is often miscomprehended ......





I beleive statistically around 25pc of the population are Introverts, as a comparison, Extroverts are generally energised from being around other people.

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This discussion is actually most helpful. Missus thinks I'm an extrovert because I'll happily socialize, speak in public, be different, whatever. But like Prospector, I much prefer small gatherings, intimate meaningful conversations over blather, hate the phone etc.

And I need time in my cave.

It also explains why some people love trading for a living (a lonely pastime) whereas it would drive others insane, who need an outside job business etc.

Interesting.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Prospector said:

So as a fellow INFJ'er along with Julia, I am just tracking through your posts to see if you are true to your title...:

(Must be a lot of rocking horses around...)

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Just read this and now im feeling paranoid and stalked!

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Hell , I'm gonna push on down this lonely road folllowing this theory I've got about all of us being part chiild, part adult, part parent.
(Thomas Harris's "I'm OK, you're OK" philosophy).
Just thinking aloud, but I'd rate people as follows :-

Zorba (child, loved to dance - I mean parents and adults don't dance, unless they let their hair down and become children - just IMO of course, DYOR lol)
Maria Von Trapp (child, start of the movie, ditto)
Count Von Trapp (parent , start of the movie)
Edna Everidge, Paul Hogan, Billy Connolly, Norm Gunston, Chasers, Monty Python, any comedian (child)
Steve Irwin, Julius Sumner Miller, Fred Hollows, (child, overflowing with enthusiasm, enjoying themselves in their work)

Ruth Cracknell in Mother and Son (unpredictable, humourous child, plus
manipulating (ugly) parent )
Fred Nile (parent)
Anyone who tries to tell you there's a Hell ( parent)

School Bully (ugly child)
Hitler , beginning of war, eg the fabricated attack by Poland on Germany (cunning, Ugly Adult )
Hitler, end of war, screaming idiot , sending everyone to the western front (Ugly Parent)

Fung Sui ,the part that believes in spirits moving around your house, mustn't come straight in etc (Hopeful Child, not based in the adult anyway, some might disagree, big element of "hope I'm right, no way to prove it either way")

Zen Meditation (I'd say adult when it's about the effects on the mind and body - all measureable, not sure about buying shares by Zen however lol - child hopefullness there I'd have thought)

Religious prayer (adult when you're enjoying the benefits of meditation-like prayer; or maybe when you see forgiveness working etc, all measureable - not sure about the heaven and hell bits - just IMO of course ),

Macbeth when being lead by his wife (Ugly Child)
Lady Macbeth (Ugly Parent)
Hamlet , jealous about uncle, rebuking his mother (ugly child - with cause lol, maybe reasonable adult )
Hamlet , cruel to Ophelia (ugly child), etc etc
Yorrick - now, he's just stuffed...

PS further to this theory (my version anyway), we should all try to spend as much time in child mode (fun, enjoyment of life) and as little time in parent mode (lecturing) as poss. Here endeth the lecture.

PS I'd better re-read that book, lol - I'm probably misquoting him something fierce. I notice some reviews on Wikipedia emphasise completely different things to me for instance. I'm assuming, for instance, that everyone here is "I'm OK, You're OK", ok?

I mean, some reviews also look at where he considers people who are
a) "I'm OK , You're not OK" = potentially homicidal
b) "I'm not ok, You're OK" = potentially suicidal
c) "I'm not OK, You're not OK" = stay well clear, anthing's likely to happen. (Homicidal / suicidal)
Anyway they're the parts of the book I skipped I like the review below instead.

http://www.amazon.com/Im-Youre-M-D-Thomas-Harris/dp/1578660750
Book Description. With more than 7 million copies sold, and a spot on the New York Times Bestseller list, this pioneering self-help guide transformed the lives of countless readers.

"Harris has stripped away the technical language of psychoanalysis and presents with lucid logic a way to self-understanding and change."--The Los Angeles Times


Are you okay? That's probably the most important question anyone will ever answer, and Dr. Thomas Harris's groundbreaking bestseller helped millions respond in the affirmative. Using Transactional Analysis, which confronts the individual with the fact that he or she is responsible for what happens in the future, Dr. Harris explained how to distinguish the three active elements that make up everyone's personality (Parent, Adult, and Child), as well as the four life positions underlying people's actions. Best of all, his theories are presented in wonderfully easy-to-understand language, and there's practical advice on how to change harmful behavior. Anyone can lead a happier, more effective life and better understand friends and family.

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In summary, follow Bily Connolly rather than Fred Nile

PS and when you have to lecture, do it tongue in cheek , eg "and if you fall off that swing and break you leg, don't come running to me etc " - you all know the one.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Very interesting, i am INTJ

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Hey 2020, the parent adult child proposal is part of Transactional Analysis Theory and it describes how people behave in situations, as opposed to their personality types, which is who they are. (An analogy is weather v's climate!)

Behaviour varies from situation to situation, whereas personality traits remain constant in any situation, therefore being reasonably predictable and that is the validity theory on which those personality tests are based. Hence, lending support for your contention that Parent Adult child behaviour varies, however a deeper analysis of personality will show that overall, while personality can be modified (eg by experience, especially traumatic) , unlike behavior, it doesnt change from moment to moment or situation to situation.

While you suggest we should all follow our 'child' mode, that is the least productive form of behaviour and invariably invokes others to become 'parents' of the child. All mature interactions occur in the 'Adult - Adult' mode. Be a child if you want, just expect others to behave as your parent!

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Prospector said:

Hey 2020,
1. the parent adult child proposal is part of Transactional Analysis Theory and it describes how people behave in situations,
2. as opposed to their personality types, which is who they are.
3. (An analogy is weather v's climate!)
4. Behaviour varies from situation to situation, whereas personality traits remain constant in any situation, therefore being reasonably predictable and that is the validity theory on which those personality tests are based.
5.Hence, lending support for your contention that Parent Adult child behaviour varies, however a deeper analysis of personality will show that overall, while personality can be modified (eg by experience, especially traumatic) , unlike behavior, it doesnt change from moment to moment or situation to situation.
6. While you suggest we should all follow our 'child' mode, that is the least productive form of behaviour and invariably invokes others to become 'parents' of the child. All mature interactions occur in the 'Adult - Adult' mode.
7. Be a child if you want, just expect others to behave as your parent!

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lol - okok- we will probably agree to disagree
1. TA - yep - can't find that book , but yep - the part I really liked was the concept of games ... predctable games between two people , where eg one person's parent "hooks" another person's "child" etc.- usually ends in yelling, or submission or etc etc. (these being the two irrational parts of our makeup.
Women who always fall in love with someone who will mistreat them etc.
Or maybe the play / movie "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf" etc http://www.amazon.com/Whos-Afraid-Virginia-Woolf-Wolfe/dp/0689705654

This is the stuff real drama is made:the human soul.And we see four torn, ravaged soul caught in a maelstrom of bitter emotions caused by frustration,unrequited love,anger and guilt feelings. Martha can't understand George's despair, that his apathy is generated by his ultimate failure to find a source of hope and meaning in his life; George can't understand the frustration of Martha, her own feeling of failure being incapable to connect whit him, to save him from his passive/aggressive depression; nor can Nick and Honey comprehend them, and indeed themselves. The sadistic rituals of games are like pagan sacrifices, made by the characters to the god of modern angst to know the truth on themselves. As the sad truth is revealed, they emerge maybe purified, surely wiser.This drama is like an interpretation of Eliot's Wasteland . The spirit, expecially in the final scenes,is very similar.

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Long time since I saw it , but I recall Richard Burton and Liz Taylor playing an extended "game" throughout the movie.
Personally if I get caught in a game , I try (lol) to say ... "I refuse to play this game !!" don't always succeed lol. But I can't stand constant "ain't it awful" or "outrage outrage " etc.

Btw, lol, I am equally interested in how people mis behave in situations .

2. 4, 5. personality constant ? mmm I probably disagree (depends how we define our terms) - we all have moods. (including having our "parent" hooked when the kids keep screaming, or our "child" hooked when we being spoken down to etc. - but if you allow me that flexibility of emotion, I can accept that a multi-faceted personality is an option - might take years to map all the facets though IMO. and as you say, might change with trauma ( for sure ), or with 3 minutes of hang gliding for that matter lol.

3. weather vs climate - nice simile. some people are like a bludy thunderstorm, some like a bright blue sky, some like constant rain - complete with mould lol.
(PS when I see a challenge, like a mountain, I climate )

6. all best interactions in adult-adult - no way !! lol ,
7. children need adults - no way !!

ok ok - we agree to disagree.

PS I leave you with this thought !!!
http://www.unoriginal.co.uk/footage81_4.html
who's in control here - the kids? or the parents ? lol

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

OK OK
let's tackle this thing from a different direction.
On the subject of "friendship", and "dependency", and "our autonomy"
Anyone see the play "Art". (the play revolves around a painting that is just a blank canvas, lol, but in reality it is about friendship)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/'Art'_(play)

anyway ... In it, there is a quote .
"If I am I because I am I,
and you are you, because you are you;
then I am I , and you are you

but if I am I because you are you,
and you are you because I am I
then ..
I am not I
and you are not you."

Personally I prefer the concept of synergy - (if you can see what I'm getting at).
"synergy :- The interaction of two or more agents or forces so that their combined effect is greater than the sum of their individual effects. "

I mean, I had friendships when I was a kid which meant far more than "the sum of the parts" if you know what I mean.
And I've always suspected that quote (if I am I etc ) as being .. incorrect / sterile just IMO .

Feel free to tell me I misunderstood the play completely lol.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

2020hindsight said:

"If I am I "

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I am reminded of a song in HK
"marn ngau foon foo sing yow gai door
marn ngau bay hok sing yow gai door ...
ngau hai ngau"
which translates something like ...

"Ask me how happy I am,
ask me how sad I am
I just say, I am me."

i.e. do we really know all our own moods ?
(ps ask me that again when I'm sober lol)

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Prospector said:

While you suggest we should all follow our 'child' mode, that is the least productive form of behaviour and invariably invokes others to become 'parents' of the child. All mature interactions occur in the 'Adult - Adult' mode. Be a child if you want, just expect others to behave as your parent!

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Ah, Prospector, such a great summing up.
One of life's great frustrations is trying to have a discussion as an adult with someone in their child mode.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Julia said:

Ah, Prospector, such a great summing up.
One of life's great frustrations is trying to have a discussion as an adult with someone in their child mode.

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Julia and Prospector.
sheesh - here's a question.
what mode is Billy Connolly in when he's on stage?
surely it's child yes?
do you find that frustrating?
(PS I find it hilarious )

OR
you meet mates for a Friday night drink -
surely they are in child mode (?)
the last thing you want is for them to be straight backed adults (IMO)

(maybe we differ with our terms here? lol )

PS our "child " is the most interesting part of us - it is where our "original personality " resides. Just as that "seven up series" suggests. (again IMO)

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

2020hindsight said:

OK OK

anyway ... In it, there is a quote .
"If I am I because I am I,
and you are you, because you are you;
then I am I , and you are you

but if I am I because you are you,
and you are you because I am I
then ..
I am not I
and you are not you."

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Unless you get the tardis to take us back 50 years, or youre a stalker of Kingdom Halls......... I think this ones long gone, 20/20.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Freeballinginawetsuit said:

Unless you get the tardis to take us back 50 years, or youre a stalker of Kingdom Halls......... I think this ones long gone, 20/20.

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I'm gonna do a Pauline Hanson lol - "pls explain !!"

PS or is it that you're asking ME to explain lol?

I will add that I've only heard that quoted once - the words kinda fascinated me.- and it has stuck with me ever since -

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

I don't think many really get past the "I" and "You" to a point where it is one and the same............and even more.

Or maybe youre quote is talking about people.......... trying to be something thier not........ for the sake of the other person!

Forgive me if I have read into it, the mushy version.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

I have always assumed that it means
a) "If you and I are both stand-alone islands , independent of each other, then great, we both can prove our arms-length existence,

b) but if we are mutually interdependent, (through a strong friendship), to the point where synergy makes our friendship more than the sum of us as individuals , then neither of us exists independently".

The implication is that we are the weaker for it. This is where I disagree.

My criticism of a) is that "No man is an island",
and my criticism of b) is that, IMO, we are the stronger for such a valuable friendship ("devoutly to be wished" )

lol, jog on , as Ducati would say

PS I have an advantage I guess - I saw the play - with my daughter who was probably 10 at the time lol - must ask her what she recalls its meaning to be

PPS at the risk of trivialising the concept of friendship - I would say that the bond between a dog and a man almost qualifies for a synergy situation

PPS I still don't know where poetry fits in the child - adult - parent classification thing lol.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

I didn't read the bit above youre quote, should have in retrospect.

I would agree though that the 'Synergy' from two like minded/compatable entity's would be more than the sum of the singular. Seems logical.

But I would also admit that a lot of youre quotes are way past my depth process 20/20.......

Jog on and I shalll wallow in my ignorance

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

lol - it's all dead simple m8,
here's an extract from a poem #91 on poetry thread , "How do you measure love grasshopper" ... and btw, "love" (arguably) means (IMO) that the union means more than the sum of the parts...

"Pet:-
as a Pet-owner then, is it energy given to Mutual wagging of tails,
or do Horse-lovers judge the worth of their love, by the Height of some steeplechase rails,
or the “Heil-boss-well-met” when you put on their reins (and it never rains but it hails ),
or just Sad that you miss ‘em - extinction or kiss ‘em – including koalas and whales.
sure the Depths of that love are tested so oft,
when they Piss on the daisies, or buck you right off,
but you Miss em like hell with that last mortal cough,
and if That isn’t love, I’ll eat snails. "

PS ... In Churchills bodyguard (Friday nights) Walter proudly states that he grew to love the man . true respect.

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

just wanna post a correction - or rather the possibility that there are many interpretations to that quote back there

what I don't like about that quote "if I am I and you are you etc" is that it seems to preclude the opportunity that synergy offers.
I agree that it doesn't mean that necessarily, and that interpretation you made feeball is equally valid when I think about it.

i.e. not so much that people benefit by another's company, more that they are malleable in each others company (I would STILL argue that that's not necessarily a bad thing). - so long I guess as they aren't so wishy washy that they are a non-entity.

In summary, I believe that "I am I because you are you" can also imply synergy, and can be a positive in some strong friendship situations.


As for the other "draft personality theory" back there ....likewise, I'm sure others would define Billy Connolly on stage , not so much as child mode, but as "happy adult" mode , indeed maybe too clever to be child - but in my mind cool: ) - apart from the fact that it echoes in here lol - in my mind, the best jokes are the ones that get a response that is very similar to "hooking our child".- involuntary laughter almost.

(maybe Billy Connnolly is just a clever funny adult, and the audience - at least the best audiences - are the ones in child mode )

PS I recall a Charlie Brown comic strip. Lucy has told him he's "wishy washy", and he's obviously not said anything at the time in response ( Charlie's repartee is not his strong point lol) and you see him walking along later ...
"I'm gonna try not to be wishy washy any more...
(thinks hard)
"I know!", he says, "maybe I'll be wishy today, and washy tomorrow"
that's it im off to earn a crust.
I'd post the 2 cents icon, but I've run out of icons

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

INFJ with my career (art - design) being in their selection. I did this test 20 years ago with the same result - interesting

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Realist - xxFJ

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Ahh wrong...

This is what I got...


Your Type is
ENTP
Extraverted Intuitive Thinking Perceiving
Strength of the preferences %
22 25 88 22

Re: Myers Briggs personality type

Here's an exercise for a rainy day
Pretend you are Homer Simpson - and carry out the test.
apart from the fact that you apprecaite just how much they repeat those questions, you also find yourself answering " no I don't like meeting deadlines"' etc lol
Anyway for what it's worth , I reckon he's an ESFP. (I reckon he's pretty extroverted for a start - and totally irresponsible, lol, although I don't know how you work that our from ESFP?)

which means he scores high on "sensing" (whatever that really means) and low on just about everything else ... Doh!

Btw, to refresh your memory of his personality, here's wikipedia's take on him (as if anyone can forget lol):-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homer_Simpson

Homer's personality is one of frequent stupidity, laziness and explosive anger, one might say the "Average Joe." He also suffers from a short attention span which complements his intense but short-lived passion for hobbies, enterprises and various causes. Homer is prone to emotion, gets very envious of his neighbors, the Flanders family, is easily enraged at his son Bart, and strangles him in an exaggerated manner. He shows no compunction about this, and does not attempt to hide his actions from people outside the family, even leaving Bart alone at a port.[16] While Homer has repeatedly upset people and caused all sorts of mayhem in Springfield, these events are usually caused by either his explosive temper or a lack of foresight. Except for expressing annoyance at Ned Flanders, Homer's actions are usually unintentional. Most of his explosive anger is targeted on Bart, because of something stupid or bad he had said or done. Despite their disadvantages, these common outbursts save Homer from dying of a pent-up rage induced heart attack.[17]

While Homer's stupid antics often upset his family, he has also performed acts that reveal him to be surprisingly loving father and husband: selling his cherished ride on the Duff blimp and using the money to enter Lisa in a beauty pageant so she could feel better about herself; giving up his chance at wealth to allow Maggie to keep a cherished teddy bear; using a portable nuclear pile to get Bart's money back from the crooked businessman who had swindled him; spearheading an attempt to dig Bart out after he had fallen down a well, even though Homer generally hates doing physical labor; and arranging a surprise second wedding with Marge to make up for their lousy first ceremony, even going so far as to hire one of the Doobie Brothers as part of the wedding band and getting a divorce from Marge, essentially making their second wedding a "real" one.[citations needed]

Homer tends to derive amusement from the misfortune of others. He is a chronic petty thief and borderline kleptomaniac, stealing from Ned Flanders everything from TV trays to power tools and air conditioners, even an entire room of the Flanders' house (often, he will take advantage of Ned's good nature, borrowing things he has no intention of ever returning). He has also stolen golf balls from the local driving range, office supplies (including computers) from work, and beer mugs from Moe's Tavern.[18]

Homer has a vacuous mind, but he is still able to retain a great amount of knowledge about very specific subjects. He shows small bursts of astonishing insight, memory, creativity, and fluency with many languages in nearly every episode. (Example: "You can't sell that! Karma can only be portioned out by the cosmos"). In some episodes, he has displayed a polished talent for singing and songwriting.[13] However, his brief periods of intelligence are overshadowed by much longer and consistent periods of ignorance, forgetfulness and stupidity.... etc

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