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Is Global Warming becoming unstoppable?

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SirRumpole said:
The simple calculator I posted confirms those calcs.

I don't know if it's realistic to assume that the RH will stay the same though.
Click to expand...

Enthalpies come into the works so it's better illustrated as such. Lotsa contiguous variables

Good news is that the more water in the air the lower the sea level
 
Tisme if you cared to read the original paper you would have seen how the CC scientists arrived at the conclusion that if global warming continues at its current pace the food bowl of China would face catastophic heatwaves.

I did post sections from it. It isn't hard to see the whole paper. I'm quite confident they have the smarts to work out the effects of
1) The current climatic conditions
2) The extra heat load from ogoing CC warming under the two scenarios they posited
3) The additional heat/humidity effects created by the irrigation poured onto the region.

The results are challenging to put it mildly. The paper was not examining the whole world environment. It was geographically specific. Unfortunately you chose to say and then repeat that this was not true because it would take 12C of global warming for the scenario in China to be played out. But what you were actually saying was at 12C extra warming the whole world would be in a near permanent state of uninhabitability.

Again this is pure mis-direction and quite poor logic. The issue about weather extremes caused by CC is not whether we reach 3-4-6 or 12C increases in average global temperature. It is about the impact of hitherto never seen events that go beyond the survival capacity of current eco systems.

In this catergory we now see fire storms fuelled by record high temperatures and exceptionally dry grounds.

There are hurricanes that reach newly created Catergory 6 levels because the oceans that feed them are so much warmer.

We see rain events which drop unprecedented amounts of water (because of the extra moisture held in the atmosphere) causing instant floods.

And we now risk seeing heatwaves that take temperatures beyond the survival capacity of people and animals in many parts of the world.

I don't really get much entertainment value from these posts. I'd much prefer a more constructive dialogue that helped move people to demanding whatever effective response we can make to keep some semblance of a functioning eco system for us and our children.

basilio said:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-018-05252-y
Click to expand...
 
I've already provided you a site specific scenario pertinent to China. What we choose to read into non peer reviewed articles that are actually Guardian journalistic licence applied to the original works is always going to be contentious.

Blind Freddy knows we are in climatic anomaly, but we have to sift out the tall tales and true with practical science, not sensationalism and mastheads.

Just look at this and ask yourself why and how do people survive in Darwin.....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-29/wet-bulb-temperatures.jpg/6658166

What we really know from real data is that design is 33.9Cdb 23.8Cwb and all the air conditioning, cooling towers for power stations, etc are predicated on those figures and they work well.
 
Which is why you can read the original peer reviewed article on China and discover that in fact The Guardian did not over egg the story.
This is real stuff "12C"Tizzie.

North China Plain threatened by deadly heatwaves due to climate change and irrigation
Nature Communicationsvolume 9, Article number: 2894 (2018) | Download Citation

Abstract
North China Plain is the heartland of modern China. This fertile plain has experienced vast expansion of irrigated agriculture which cools surface temperature and moistens surface air, but boosts integrated measures of temperature and humidity, and hence enhances intensity of heatwaves. Here, we project based on an ensemble of high-resolution regional climate model simulations that climate change would add significantly to the anthropogenic effects of irrigation, increasing the risk from heatwaves in this region. Under the business-as-usual scenario of greenhouse gas emissions, North China Plain is likely to experience deadly heatwaves with wet-bulb temperature exceeding the threshold defining what Chinese farmers may tolerate while working outdoors. China is currently the largest contributor to the emissions of greenhouse gases, with potentially serious implications to its own population: continuation of the current pattern of global emissions may limit habitability in the most populous region, of the most populous country on Earth.
 
Perhaps Darwin won't be that inhabitable in a few decades. A neat short video clip in this story as well.

Deadly mix of heatwaves and humidity could make some Australian cities virtually ‘uninhabitable’
WITH temperatures nudging 70C, this CBD has already been dubbed a “river of fire”. Deadly heatwaves could make it a no-go zone.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/...e/news-story/f90ff75e2f982e741efc714a1b7cf0a6
 
What we are witnessing across the planet are extremes.

The monitoring charts/measurements do not account for this.

In the same time/latitude zones, 10 deg in a place, 30 in another, average 20.
 


Jebus I can't believe the pig headed nonsense, 70deg C is quoted as surface temperature for goodness sakes. You are just playing to rusted ons and your own entrenched narrative. "12CTizzie" childish taunts speaks heaps on your maturity level.... waste of space really.
 
explod said:
What we are witnessing across the planet are extremes.

The monitoring charts/measurements do not account for this.

In the same time/latitude zones, 10 deg in a place, 30 in another, average 20.
Click to expand...

Examples?
 
explod said:
https://public.wmo.int/en/media/news/july-sees-extreme-weather-high-impacts
Click to expand...

The Trump admin just got rid of higher fuel efficiency standards. Claiming that higher fuel efficiency is bad for motorists health. Yes, I'm pretty sure I heard that correctly.

I'm guessing Trump feels the pain of motorist getting stuck in the heat. So if gov't interfere and demand better engines, it'll be.... slower to get home?

I thought a democratic system like the US was supposed to be fool-proof where any idiot can be in charge and it'll operate just fine. How much damage can one administration do, right?

In the past 18 years, they have 8 of Bush Jr., then Obama kinda not really saved it but didn't really ruin it either... and now Trump.
 
https://www.news.com.au/technology/...e/news-story/78a7f050d66f7065f0beb3d5e2ac923e

Nothing to worry about here. Ask anyone about England and the first thing they'll tell you is the place is stinking hot, that's common knowledge. Oh wait.....

For those who haven't been there, I'll add that one problem they'll be having is that owning any sort of cooling system isn't at all common in the UK since normally there's simply no need to even consider it. Heating yes, they do that far better than we do in Australia with hot water running through radiators just about everywhere, but even in situations like public buildings etc it's not uncommon that there's no form of mechanical cooling system. Add in the reality of people not being used to the heat and it's going to be a rather miserable experience surely.

One incident like this could be readily dismissed as just natural weather variation but this is becoming rather common.
 


There's a recent bushfire in Sweden? How is that possible?

Flooding in India last week killed some 500? New heat records set across Africa, the US, Japan, Canada?

But I guess when it's common enough, it's "normal"
 
luutzu said:
The Trump admin just got rid of higher fuel efficiency standards. Claiming that higher fuel efficiency is bad for motorists health.
Click to expand...
If that's true then it wins the award for being truly bizarre.

Arguments for or against fuel efficiency standards and for or against all things Trump aside, that one just seems truly ridiculous.

Fuel efficiency is bad for your health?

That's a bit like saying the council has decided to ban nightclubs stamping wrists on Saturday nights because it's causing littering in the botanical gardens on Tuesday afternoons. Or someone's banning the ringing of church bells on Sunday morning in Darwin because the noise might disrupt an outdoor concert in Melbourne that was on the previous day. It makes no sense whatsoever no matter how you look at it and is one of the sillier things I've ever heard really.
 
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luutzu said:
There's a recent bushfire in Sweden? How is that possible?
Click to expand...
Part of the trouble with all this is that at a guess people in Sweden probably aren't too good at dealing with bushfires. Lack of experience on what to do, lack of equipment to do it with, etc. That's not being critical but you can't expect them to be experts on dealing with a problem that they haven't had to worry about historically.

When it comes to the heat, well you might go to the Middle East if you want to see how to cope with that but you wouldn't think of asking someone from Scotland. Therein lies a big part of the problem with climate change - consider everything built by man and realise that none of it was built to be suited to a different climate. Some things wont matter, Stonehenge or the Great Wall of China won't likely fall over because it's a bit warmer, but it's a huge problem with everything from water supply to buildings to power.
 

They claim it'll save lives because cars with better safety features will be cheaper. Hey, I didn't say it

 

The US knows how to deal with bush(forest) fires, but they still need help from Australia and NZ, and of course we can call on them if we need it.

So the conclusion is that the problem is getting beyond the ability of the local authorities to handle. Our firefighters and those in other countries could be working all year round if the situation gets any worse.

Scary stuff.
 

You might like to look at Canary Wharf development .... mechanical services are fairly vast and QLD people played a big part in getting it up and running
 

Pig Headed nonsense ? Are you brushing your hair "12C" Tizzie?

That was a surprisingly good analysis of what is happening Darwin. It looked at the current range of ground temperatures in different environments around Darwin as well as considering an even hotter future. Not surprisingly areas of concrete were exceptionally hot. Basically the heat island effect produced by big cities which results in urban temperatures being many degrees higher than the official met. temperatures recorded in protected stevenson screens a metre off the ground.

Engineers everywhere will tell you this heat island effect will put far more pressure on city infrastructure as very hot conditions turn into completly unbearable. And that of course was the point of the story wasn't it ?

But returning to pig headed nonsense ..MissDirect. I have stuck you with the moniker of "12C" Tizzie because you repeatedly stated that the world needed to warm by 12C in order for conditions in China to reach catastropohic heat waves levels from 2070 onwards. And not only did you manange to make a total fool of yourself trying to prove that we needed 12C of global warming to parboil 400 m Chinese (and everyone else ..) but then you tried to deny you ever said it ! And you never even had the grace to respond to the peer reviewed article in Nature journal that I cited.

Honestly Tisme I just couldn't get in the ring with you for pig headed nonsense. Your way outa my league..
 
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