ELECTIONS - Labor or Liberal

[Smurf1976]

At one stage, Tim Costello strongly considered running for the Democrats in the Senate. I would view him as being a small "l" liberal in terms of political philosophy. Whilst Mayor of St Kilda he cleaned up the area's image. Property prices there have since gone through the roof.

Yet another inflation-producing Liberal. Just what the speculators need and the poor fear most.

 

[greggy]

Yet another inflation-producing Liberal. Just what the speculators need and the poor fear most.

Hi Smurf,

I would be very surprised if Tim Costello votes Liberal so it would be unfair to label him as being another inflation-producing Liberal. He's a firm believer in social justice. He has done a lot of good work helping the homeless and other forgotten members of our society. His political philosophy IMO is small "l" liberal. In terms of political philosophy, there's a number of people in all mainstream political parties that would identify themselves as having this philosophy. I remember my past discussions with a number of Democrat voters who identified themselves as small "l" liberals as well as a number of Howard's battlers. Also, the same can be said about many voters in the US who back the Democrats there. Anyone bored enough to read any of my past posts would realise that I too fit into this group.
At the last state election I voted Labor yet at the previous federal election I voted Liberal. After seeing Latham turn on his Labor mates in a very vulgar way via his book vindicated my stand at the last election. He had some good ideas but IMO was too volatile. Interest rates were also lower at the time. Voters tend to go for a safe pair of hands so to speak. Maybe that's one of the reasons why Rudd's doing so well in the polls. To some extent, he looks like a younger version of Howard. Rudd is a bookworm, wears glasses, fairly humble and is a fiscal conservative. He's also agreeing with many of Hoaward's policies on water, aboriginees etc. The main points of difference seem to be IR and Iraq. On both issues most voters are backing Rudd's stand.

 

[Julia]

Hi Smurf,

I would be very surprised if Tim Costello votes Liberal so it would be unfair to label him as being another inflation-producing Liberal. He's a firm believer in social justice. He has done a lot of good work helping the homeless and other forgotten members of our society. His political philosophy IMO is small "l" liberal.

I agree about Tim Costello. He seems a really genuine person, engaged in doing all he can for people who need help. Hard to believe the two are brothers in terms of their apparent personalities.

 

[whitta27]

Firstly Tim Costello is a tremendous person and has had a great influence on many people, as mayor of St Kilda, head of World Vision and many other positions he has taken on.

I think it is very unfair to compare Peter to him though.
Everyone says if only Peter had the compassion Tim has.

Who says he doesn't.. In the position peter is in I think it is very hard for him to show his true colours. Everybody hates paying tax and Pete Costello has been the taxing minister for the last 10 years, its politically correct in this country to dislike the man.

I'll give you a tip, political correctness in this country is about as thin as a matchstick. People at dinner tables having tea with associates discussing how much they made last year on the sharemarket, put their fake socially acceptable politically correct facade on. Howard knows this .. its politically correct to mock Howard.. You don't think he knows political correctness is matchstick thin. He doesn't have to make the media portray him as anything special. He just has to relate to the conservative dominant ideology that is within most.. not everyones, minds at the ballot box.

People mock politicians and comment on their lack of compassion and care for others.. Yes they do make some bad decisions but ultimately they do a considerable amount of good for little in return.

I don't think Peter Costello will be Prime Minister but if he were to make it to the post I think thats when peoples oppinions of him would change as he would be able to get out of his number crunching position and maybe show some of the same attributes that have been bottled up, that his brother Tim has been blessed with and been able to show through the career he has chosen.

whit

 

[bingk6]

Who says he doesn't.. In the position peter is in I think it is very hard for him to show his true colours. Everybody hates paying tax and Pete Costello has been the taxing minister for the last 10 years, its politically correct in this country to dislike the man.

I don't think Peter Costello will be Prime Minister but if he were to make it to the post I think thats when peoples oppinions of him would change as he would be able to get out of his number crunching position and maybe show some of the same attributes that have been bottled up, that his brother Tim has been blessed with and been able to show through the career he has chosen.

whit

I believe that deep down, Costello is quite a decent chap, despite that smirk - which I grant does him no good whatsoever. However, he'll never be PM, because Howard will make sure of it, which is a real shame because he has been a loyal deputy for so long and certainly deserves his opportunity to show the public what is he capable of. After all, he has contributed more than his fair share in getting the government's economic credentials up, but hey, what does Howard know about fairness and justice ????

 

[Julia]

I believe that deep down, Costello is quite a decent chap, despite that smirk - which I grant does him no good whatsoever. However, he'll never be PM, because Howard will make sure of it, which is a real shame because he has been a loyal deputy for so long and certainly deserves his opportunity to show the public what is he capable of. After all, he has contributed more than his fair share in getting the government's economic credentials up, but hey, what does Howard know about fairness and justice ????

How do you feel Howard will make sure Peter Costello will never be PM?
How is this within his control?
Who would you suggest would succeed John Howard if it's not Costello?

 

[Sprinter79]

I would laugh so hard it the Libs won the election but Howard lost his seat hahaha

 

[--B--]

hey b,

would u mind telling us a little about yourself, what u do, where you're from, hobbies etc, as im kind of interested to know what sort of person thinks like you do.

arminius, im just an average australian white collar worker who despises terrorists and terrorism.

im more interested to know about you, who apparently sympathises with the likes of David Hicks?

 

[explod]

arminius, im just an average australian white collar worker who despises terrorists and terrorism.

im more interested to know about you, who apparently sympathises with the likes of David Hicks?

I am not a David Hicks sympathiser but I am concerned about the unfounded evidence that is reducing our civil rights.

As with a lot of young people who push the envelope, Hicks thought it was trendy to go the opposite way and found himself at the wrong place at the wrong time.. I dispise terrorism also and it breeds through ignorance and repression. Unlike the old Columbo Plan idea we no longer provide adequate funding for re/-education for the less well off, rather for our own interestes we interfere in the sovereign affairs of others and point guns at them. This in my view just creates more terrorists

 

[Rafa]

arminius, im just an average australian white collar worker who despises terrorists and terrorism.

thats great, so am i...

which is why i am livid howard as made us a bigger terrorist target by being an ally of bush in iraq...

when...
1. A strong iraq was vital to balance out the real terrorists, i.e. iran
2. Saddam Hussien absolutely hated Osama Bin Laden, and Al Qaeda never had a foothold in Iraq until the US invaded them... Now Iraq is the centerpiece of Al Qaeda a souce of inspiration to possible recruits. (the recent US report on the war backs up that statement)...
3. By detracting from the efforts in Afghanistan, Bin Laden, who was within the cross hairs, was let free...

It makes me think Bush / Howard prefer to have the terrorists florish so they can keep the misrable populace afraid and divided...

if you seriously wanted peace, you would want a leader who could lead and unite, not divide and rule. Howard track record shows he is the latter... there are many easily swayed by his rhetoric...

the facts are since he's been in power, he has let in more muslims than any other prime minister... and his lack focus on training australians coupled with the 457 visa class has delivered into australia our very own terrorist sympathiser (allegedly, if the AFP are to be beleived and this who thing is not just another tamap)...

He only talks, to keep people like you happy and thinking he is great for national security!

 

[greggy]

I agree about Tim Costello. He seems a really genuine person, engaged in doing all he can for people who need help. Hard to believe the two are brothers in terms of their apparent personalities.

Hi Julia,

I have the upmost respect for Tim. In relation to his brother Peter, he may be regarded as a conservative on economic matters but on social issues is considered to be liberal. He's also a republican. Didn't he also take part in the nationwide "Reconciliation" march? I think that his unfortunate problem is that he's seen as being similar in personal character to Keating. Peter needs to get rid of his smirk and the perceived arrogance. If he wants the top job he's had plenty of time until now to challenge Mr Howard. Maybe he just doesn't have the numbers.

 

[YELNATS]

I would laugh so hard it the Libs won the election but Howard lost his seat hahaha

If that happened do you think maybe the Libs would immediately force a by-election, by sacrificing one of their MP's, in order to get John back in parliament and the leadership?

 

[greggy]

If that happened do you think maybe the Libs would immediately force a by-election, by sacrificing one of their MP's, in order to get John back in parliament and the leadership?

Hi Yelnats,

Perhaps Peter Costello would make a good one considering how Howard must be feeling at present. LOL!

 

[trading_rookie]

which is why i am livid howard as made us a bigger terrorist target by being an ally of bush in iraq...

A foiled attack on the Lucas Heights reactor (2000 Olympics) by terrorists occurred before we joined Gulf War II...I consider that to the 'mother' of all targets.

ps - thanks Wayne for the edit

ps2 - so Rudd won't follow Latham into supporting the greens over logging Tassie forests? Well so much for 'green' Rudd. What a hypocrite.

 

[arminius]

b,

why indeed would i, ex infantry, sympathise with d.hicks?
why would i, rugby prop, hesitate to dive into a fight in iraq?

the answer is at the heart of it all. rafa and explod said it beautifully.

justice.
it is the glue holding it all together. take it away and you've got anarchy. think about it for a while.
if you or i are accused of a crime id like to think the judicial system would sort it out. guilty or innocent. do the crime do the time. stitching someone up for political gain reeks of fascist germany in the 1930's.
re-read rafa and explod, and many others. talk to your kids about it, and the missus. forget about who you want to be PM for a minute. THINK.
i sat back and enjoyed the first gulf war and argued we should be supporting our allies-thats what allies do. this one is totally different. Bush /cheney/wolfowitz etc are deranged. most of America want out, including many powerful republicans. the whole world wants the US out, except bush, johnny, and you lot.

if i, or you perhaps, had lost family or friends to an american bullet, I/we'd take up arms.

the french super army of 1810 called the spanish guerillas 'terrorists'. they killed the french by whatever means they could. rendered the invasion untenable, and the iraqis will do the same. remember, one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter eh.

these are dangerous times, and it will take more courage to walk away than to hook in.

 

[Smurf1976]

A foiled attack on the Lucas Heights reactor (2000 Olympics) by terrorists occurred before we joined Gulf War II...I consider that to the 'mother' of all targets.

ps - thanks Wayne for the edit

ps2 - so Rudd won't follow Latham into supporting the greens over logging Tassie forests? Well so much for 'green' Rudd. What a hypocrite.

Surely shutting down Lucas Heights (permanently) would make more sense than adding to the 40% of Tasmania that is already either in the World Herritage Area or a National Park.

 

[krisbarry]

Why the hell would a young person vote for John Howard anyway...

Voting for John Howard is like voting in your Grandfather..if you know what I mean!

John Howard put in place the I.R. laws which are now punishing the youngest workers the most

John Howard put in place a 25% increase in HECS fees for universities

John Howard put in place the GST, a tax on a tax

John Howard has done nothing for housing affordability except make it worse, much, much worse!

John Howard lied about keeping interest rates low (they have risen 8 times under his government)

John Howard is a liar and a fossel and needs to go!!

In the words of Big Brother..."Its time to go John Howard"

** Remember when John Howard told the producers of Big Brother to get this silly show off TV **

** Well then get this silly Bastard out of Politics PLEASE! **

 

[moXJO]

b,

why indeed would i, ex infantry, sympathise with d.hicks?
why would i, rugby prop, hesitate to dive into a fight in iraq?

I could care less about Hicks, but the Iraqi war was a stupid and tragic waste of life. Neither are issues I would probably be bothered voting on. Subjects like housing, education, Inflation , Employment or idiot militant union members causing strife will be the topics affecting me. I am leaning towards Rudd but would like to see him break away more from union control before my vote is secured.They are both basically the same, one just has a clean slate atm.I think Rudd is just as smart and cunning as his liberal counterpart though.

 

[--B--]

b,

why indeed would i, ex infantry, sympathise with d.hicks?
why would i, rugby prop, hesitate to dive into a fight in iraq?

lol... i wasnt aware rugby props are known for their willingness to go fight in the war in iraq?? funny stuff indeed.

But arminius, earlier you commented that the Hicks case was so wrong on a fundamental level. are you simply referring to the time the case took to be heard? This is often what Hicks sympathisers harp on about with no regard to the many reasons for the delays (many of which were instigated by the hicks camp)

justice.
it is the glue holding it all together. take it away and you've got anarchy. think about it for a while.
if you or i are accused of a crime id like to think the judicial system would sort it out. guilty or innocent. do the crime do the time. stitching someone up for political gain reeks of fascist germany in the 1930's.
re-read rafa and explod, and many others. talk to your kids about it, and the missus. forget about who you want to be PM for a minute. THINK.
i sat back and enjoyed the first gulf war and argued we should be supporting our allies-thats what allies do. this one is totally different. Bush /cheney/wolfowitz etc are deranged. most of America want out, including many powerful republicans. the whole world wants the US out, except bush, johnny, and you lot.

What do you think will happen in iraq if the US and allies retreat tomorrow? do you think iraq will suddenly turn into a peaceful nation? do you think the threat of terrorism will evaporate? what is it?

the french super army of 1810 called the spanish guerillas 'terrorists'. they killed the french by whatever means they could. rendered the invasion untenable, and the iraqis will do the same. remember, one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter eh.

no arminius - im quite clear on what a terrorist is. Those guys who killed hundreds of innocent teenagers in Bali weren't freedom fighters mate.

 

[Sprinter79]

the Hick's confession was made under duress, therefore not admissible in a normal court of law, end of story.

Hundreds of teenagers? Hmmmmm