Commsec Starter

I have signed up with Commsec today and have just been looking through everything. I just have a couple of questions. . .

1) with expiry time (after times expired and order is cancelled.) Do you get you base money back?

2) how do you know when to pull stock?

I am so new to this I would love all the info I can get, I want to invest $$$ just need to understand in simple form on how to.

Thanks everyone ☺

ClaireB said:

I have signed up with Commsec today and have just been looking through everything. I just have a couple of questions. . .

1) with expiry time (after times expired and order is cancelled.) Do you get you base money back?

2) how do you know when to pull stock?

I am so new to this I would love all the info I can get, I want to invest $$$ just need to understand in simple form on how to.

Thanks everyone ☺

Click to expand...

welcome to ASF

not so long back they had a forum at Commsec ( several members here are Commsec refugees ) and the answers would have been given by staff

now my Commsec account is a bit quirky so please double check

now if your order is cancelled ( or purged ) the money stays in your account , ready for you to have another go ( or withdraw it )

please learn about T+2 that is the money actually leaves the account two ( trading ) days after you buy ( or arrives two days after you sell )

now the tricky part is if you sell but buy something using the credit within those two days ( NORMALLY it works fine , but sometimes there are glitches )

IF you do hit a glitch the Commsec support staff , are very good at trying to find the answers ( i know i have given them some VERY interesting problems , some beyond Commsec's control ) so if you do ring .. deep breath and try to stay as calm as possible

** 2) how do you know when to pull stock? **

if you mean cancel an order that is very much up to you ( and if Commsec isn't down for maintenance ) , NORMALLY they will stay for 28 trading days or until purged ( except for some ETFs which can purge daily )

ALSO if your order hasn't been filled ( or part-filled ) you can move it up or down ( or add more shares or make the order less ) AND extend the expiry date ( most of the time , those pesky purges sometimes get in the way ) ( the expiry date extension can also be done to part-filled orders )

sometimes i have had part-filled orders for months ( and some are purged before filling so be careful of ex-dividend dates that is one you can see coming )

cheers and good luck

divs4ever said:

welcome to ASF

not so long back they had a forum at Commsec ( several members here are Commsec refugees ) and the answers would have been given by staff

now my Commsec account is a bit quirky so please double check

now if your order is cancelled ( or purged ) the money stays in your account , ready for you to have another go ( or withdraw it )

please learn about T+2 that is the money actually leaves the account two ( trading ) days after you buy ( or arrives two days after you sell )

now the tricky part is if you sell but buy something using the credit within those two days ( NORMALLY it works fine , but sometimes there are glitches )

IF you do hit a glitch the Commsec support staff , are very good at trying to find the answers ( i know i have given them some VERY interesting problems , some beyond Commsec's control ) so if you do ring .. deep breath and try to stay as calm as possible

** 2) how do you know when to pull stock? **

if you mean cancel an order that is very much up to you ( and if Commsec isn't down for maintenance ) , NORMALLY they will stay for 28 trading days or until purged ( except for some ETFs which can purge daily )

ALSO if your order hasn't been filled ( or part-filled ) you can move it up or down ( or add more shares or make the order less ) AND extend the expiry date ( most of the time , those pesky purges sometimes get in the way ) ( the expiry date extension can also be done to part-filled orders )

sometimes i have had part-filled orders for months ( and some are purged before filling so be careful of ex-dividend dates that is one you can see coming )

cheers and good luck

Click to expand...

Thank you so much for your reply! It was so helpful and informative. I actually meant "How do you know when to sell?"

ClaireB said:

1) with expiry time (after times expired and order is cancelled.) Do you get you base money back?

Click to expand...

Firstly, welcome to ASF!

Assuming you have a CDIA or other linked account, the money stays there until settlement occurs, the timing of which is "T+2".

T+2 - that means the trade date (T) plus two business days (+2)

So settlement occurs on the second business day after the day of the purchase. Eg buy on a Tuesday = settlement will be on Thursday.

That date, the Thursday, is when the money is taken out of your CDIA or other linked account. Until then, or if you haven't bought anything, the money stays in your account.

Noting that simply placing an order isn't of itself buying. What's relevant is a transaction actually having taken place so no issue if you cancel an order before it executes.

Bear in mind there that whilst you can place an order with CommSec at any time day or night, it will only go into the market when it's open. So if I were to place an order right now then that order's not actually in the market until tomorrow morning. And if I were to cancel an order right now, it's not cancelled in the market until tomorrow. That's the way the market works so will be the same with any broker.

Note that when selling the same applies - T+2. The money will go into your account on the second business day after the trade, it's not immediate. Again that's a market thing not unique to any particular broker.

divs4ever said:

T+2

Click to expand...

Didn't see your post sorry - I've just said much the same thing.

Not trying to steal your thunder there.....

Smurf1976 said:

Didn't see your post sorry - I've just said much the same thing.

Not trying to steal your thunder there.....

Click to expand...

no problems you probably said it clearer ( and confirmed most of it )



now i don't know how other folks ( with Commsec accounts ) go but mine allows me to place orders on credit ( the required cash is NOT in a CBA account on the day the order is placed .. but is usually on the way after the trade has been made , after market ) and certain other small oddities can happen as well ( considering i DON'T have a margin loan or Commsec One account )

( Bell Direct wants the money in the account BEFORE the order can be placed )

ClaireB said:

Thank you so much for your reply! It was so helpful and informative. I actually meant "How do you know when to sell?"

Click to expand...

some of it is instinct , for example does the company management look like it is losing it's way OR is the company veering off into an area you are not comfortable with

SOMETIMES it is just straight mathematics , nothing much in the company changes but the share price rises very suddenly ( say 200% ) OR you are still in profit but the share price ( and corporate results ) go nowhere and without satisfactory excuses say SGM , or IPL )

another example is AMP i read a Bell Potter report showing how AMP faced extra duress when the Super reform regulations came in , so i decided to sell while still in a modest profit , weeks later the Hayne Royal Commission started and AMP got mauled as badly as the big 4 banks ( now AMP is about $3 lower than when i sold them in 2018 )

now for me PERSONALLY i also look at the portfolio mix ( monthly ) and see what is currently the largest holding and am i comfortable with that , at various stages in the last 10 years WOW was more than 10% of the holdings , at another time BSL was about 15% , at a different time my exposure to MQG was over 15% ( a combination of shares , preference shares and hybrids ) ( when the WOW holding was 10% to boot ) at a different time APE was well over 5% ( and top share holding ) ( SOMETIMES it is sensible to reduce a holding )

and if i hadn't sold down PME it would be currently 25% to 30% .. now a 29,000% gain looks awesome , but a 5% holding in WES pays a lot more bills ( and so does BHP )

so it is a matter of what you want from your investment

i have retired what i really need is an income stream of divs. ( rather than huge capital gains ) ( and i really can't rebuild the war chest of $xxxK again ) if all this unravels , as compared to a NASTY drop ( much worse than 2020 ) so am looking for income + survivors

but a younger person with a family , might be looking at crushing the mortgage early , or paying for the children's schooling fees ( so more $$$ the better )

cheers

Thank you so much guys! I really appreciate it. What would be a good small amount to practice with? Just till I get the knack of it. Sorry for all the questions but this is all completely new to me!

ClaireB said:

Thank you so much guys! I really appreciate it. What would be a good small amount to practice with? Just till I get the knack of it. Sorry for all the questions but this is all completely new to me!

Click to expand...

It may be better to paper trade, which is imaginary trading first.

You can also use it to find your way around Commsec and how much brokerage you would be paying.

It would help if you chose at market price initially in your paper trading but as the market is not open after 4pm on a weekday I cannot do that in the example.

So e.g. if you were buying CBA which owns Commsec, you might see it is trading at $94 buy $94.10 sell.

Tick buy say 10 and then tick what price you want to pay and whether you are willing to pay that price for today or if it falls to that within a set time. That is what is known as a limit order.

I have set that order in for 28 days. If it doesn't fall to $90 you will not get CBA at that price. If CBA does fall, imagine you own them and note the number of shares, price and brokerage.
BUT GO NO FURTHER unless you want to buy them.

It may show something like




So on paper you now own 10 Shares of CBA which including brokerage cost you $91 each. Follow what is happening with the market, CBA, the banking sector and what the seers on ASF are rabbiting on about.

When you are selling them you will be up for a similar brokerage.

When to sell.

That is the question as Shakespeare said.

gg

Whether you end up trading on fundamentals, technical analysis (TA), or take a hybrid approach, it is worth learning the basics of TA and how to interpret a chart. Books by Christopher Tate, Louise Bedford, and Alan Hull (Australian authors) are all good introductory texts on TA.

On when to sell, I find daily markets are very noisy at the moment, however there are still strong trends to be found in the weekly charts. Selling on a couple of big red down bars when price has fallen through the 20w EMA works for me (sometimes). Here are some cherry picked examples...


Note that this chart (and my markup) represent prior events that we hope to learn from, but no one can see into the future and what may happen to the market (and FMG shareprice). That's where risk management skills need to be developed and applied to protect capital, another topic for you to learn about.
Just my opinion only, not to be taken as financial advice.

Joe.

Hi ClaireB,

Thought I might add a bit of info to this discussion, regarding different ways to Buy/Sell.

Buy/Sell @ Market means you will immediately get the Nr of Shares that you want, the main problem here is that there could be some slippage (either way).....This option can only be used DURING TRADING HOURS.....

Buy/Sell @ Price means that you may NOT get the Nr of shares that you want for that price, in which case you would need to Amend your order to get the remainder of your quota....basically Traders like myself always use @ Market as we need the shares NOW because we may want to sell them in a few minutes, we need to turn our money over quickly..., Investors or longer term traders usually use @ price....

Buy/Sell @ Good for Day means that your order can only be processed TODAY, basically Traders like myself always use @ Good for Day, as we need the shares NOW because we may want to sell them in a few minutes, we need to turn our money over quickly..., Investors or longer term traders usually use @ Expiry Date....

Buy/Sell @ Expiry Date means you nominate the future date you want your order to expire, this way you may accumulate the shares over a period of time, right up to your nominated Expiry Date.

Here is an example of WHY I don’t use Buy/Sell @ Expiry Date – Let’s assume your Buy Order is placed, but only partially filled, at the end of the day you will receive a Trade Confirmation for the shares bought and for the standard Brokerage Fee, if your order completes tomorrow you should not be charged additional brokerage, and you will receive an updated Trade Confirmation... The only scenario that you will be charged extra brokerage is if the total order value goes to the next brokerage level, that is to say if the total order value exceeds $10,000....If your Buy Order was to expire and you placed a new order, you would then need to pay a second brokerage amount as it is a new order. If you are worried your order may expire before it is fully executed, you can amend the expiry date of your order online.

More info within the "Beginners Lounge/DrB Help for Beginners Forums".

Cheers.
DrB