Hi,
Trader Vic is Victor Sperandeo not Victor Niederhoffer.
MichaelD, Would you say these characters are not in the top 5%??,because they blew up.
Or were they in the top 5% before??
In a discussion about the 5% compared to the 95%, I would like to ask about the following characters.
1. Jesse Livermore. Died broke. Was he in the 5 or the 95?
EDWIN LEFEVRE: Who Couldn’t Separate His Facts from His Fiction.
Livermore came to wall street in 1906 confident and ready to conquer.
Too cocky for his own good, he lost it all in his first bust. never being one to diversify his risks, the ego maniac also didn't understand how hard it is to build a big position.
Buying stocks is different from reading the tape. If he saw a stock at 20 in the bucket shops and thought it would go to 24. He could buy at 20, and when it got to 24 he could "sell" for a 20 percent profit.
But on Wall Street he would take his $50,000 and plan to buy 2,500 shares of the stock. That was a hefty position in a market much smaller and less liquid than today's and the spread between bid and offered prices was often huge. It wasn't abnormal to see a stock quoted at 20 bid, offered at 25 - a 25 percent spread.
Suppose a stock traded last at 20 but was quoted 19 bid, offered at 21. He started buying at 21, plus commission. But then his own buying would drive the stock up. It might take him until 24 to get his entire portion built. Then, if he thought it would fall and started to sell , it might be quoted at 23 bid, offered at 24. he'd then start selling but never get a better price than 23, less commission, and take a loss on his first sale.
Then he would drive the stock down and take a loss on the liquidation of his remaining 2,500 shares. It's a lot harder to make money in reality than it is to do on paper - something which few people today, except for institutional money mangers, seem to realize. For instance, investment newsletters "manage" portfolios the same way Livermore traded bucket shops. But actually operating off the newsletters' advice is like Livermore's buying on Wall Street.
Livermore didn't get that at first. He thought he couldn't read the tape fast enough on wall street. So doing the only thing he knew to do, he headed back to replenishing his capital via bucket shops. En route, the 29-year-old stumbled upon Union pacific Railway - on a lucky hunch.
As Union Pacific rose, he sold short, anticipating a big swing. Then , just as he was about to be wiped out, his swing came in in the form of the San Francisco earthquake, halting East-West money flow and sending the railroad plummeting! Livermore quickly covered his short, took a bundle, booming a second time..... ( from Ken Fisher 100 minds that made the market
How about if you have the mindset and understanding but your (recent) realtime trading results are absolutely sh**house (Like mine!), what does that mean? LOL.
This is worth exploring. The KEY point here is the value you have assigned to your recent trading results.
Did you trade a plan?
Did you follow the plan?
Were the trading results within the plan's parameters?
If yes to all of the above, then you have traded well.
If you have traded well, why do you wish to assign a perjorative adjective to your results?
The reason we all trade is to make money. Nobody here can dispute that.
Hah Nonsense!Its all about mindset.
If you truly dont think you wish to be one of the 5% in ANYTHING then you can just about guarentee you wont be.
ROTFLMAO You just don't know which boat anyone is in here. Typically, you presume anyone with a different outlook is in a different boat achievement wise. That could be true, but the different boat could be bigger and more luxurious than yours... but they could be in the same boat, you just don't know.Its been mentioned that you may not wish to be in the 5% of anything.
That to is fine---my problem is those who are in that boat shooting cannon balls at those who dont wish to be in their boat.
A genuine observation is not an attack Tech/a. I'm trying to help you with your problem.Ah I see your usual ploy.
Nothing to add so Wayne hides behind Moderator status and resorts to personal attack.
Love it!
Michael has pretty well covered my way of thinking to most posts.
On mindset.
Its all about mindset.
If you truly dont think you wish to be one of the 5% in ANYTHING then you can just about guarentee you wont be.
I dont know about that statement.
The end thermometer of our ability to master this challenge is to make money.
Firstly you need an interest---very few out there have the same interest in trading that we do.
You definately need passion!
I personally trade because I have the above AND it is a massive challenge----an on going and exciting learning process and something that stimulates and challenges my thinking on a daily basis---it doesnt bore me. Its something I can do into my nineties if I'm lucky enough to get that far.
Gee thanks.
I'll bring up your points at my next Ego Anonymous meeting.
Catch you all in the morning.
I was going to blog this topic... thanks Wayne.:
But... by definition and inference, didn't the 5% ride Enron into bankruptcy?
And haven't the 5% been buying these financials right from the top?
How can you make money if the 95% of people aren't going in your direction after you get in? Or is it just the 5% that realise that they need the 95%?
Might be a case of measuring the incalculable...
Assuming that we think we are in the 5% / successful traders (by our own choice of measure).
Don't we need the 95%? Surely we need the 95% to follow the lead and recognise the stocks that we have picked. Is their buying, after ours, what causes the share price to rise and creates our profit?
Hah Nonsense!
An individual can wish to be 100% of what he/she can be without thought or concern of where they fit in the overall picture. They could end up in the 5% of the 5% without ever thinking about whether they are in any 5%.
This come close to it for mine. If there really is a 5%, which I personally doubt, I bet they don't spend their time talking about what makes a 5 percenter, they just get on with it.
An individual can wish to be 100% of what he/she can be without thought or concern of where they fit in the overall picture. They could end up in the 5% of the 5% without ever thinking about whether they are in any 5%.
This come close to it for mine. If there really is a 5%, which I personally doubt, I bet they don't spend their time talking about what makes a 5 percenter, they just get on with it.
I bet they don't spend their time talking about what makes a 5 percenter, they just get on with it
If there really is a 5%, which I personally doubt,
An individual can wish to be 100% of what he/she can be without thought or concern of where they fit in the overall picture. They could end up in the 5% of the 5% without ever thinking about whether they are in any 5%.
mental masturbation
Obviously youve never read a book.
Been to a seminar.
Been coached at anything.
I'll bet they dont spend 95% or even 98% of their time talking about their specialty but you can bet that everyone of them would talk freely about what makes a 5%er in their field.
Yeh Soros is just average so is Trump,Tiger Woods well hes plain average.
Sir Edmund Hilary theres another average achiever.J.K. Rowling Very average writer.
You might wish to run through the Nobel prize winners.http://orange.sims.berkeley.edu/cgi-bin/flamenco.cgi/nobel/Flamenco
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?