Australia - Indigenous Deaths in Custody

[SirRumpole]

Interesting report. (up to 2004).

It seems that non indigenous people are much more likely to die in custody than indigenous people and per head the rates are about the same.

Why don't we stop talking about indigenous deaths in custody and treat ALL deaths with equal seriousness ?

https://www.aic.gov.au/publications/tandi/tandi309

 

[SirRumpole]

This is how low we have sunk in this country, the PC idiots have taken over.

Your life does not matter unless you are black.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06...n-polley-pulls-all-lives-matter-post/12331534

 

[Value Collector]

Interesting report. (up to 2004).

It seems that non indigenous people are much more likely to die in custody than indigenous people and per head the rates are about the same.

Why don't we stop talking about indigenous deaths in custody and treat ALL deaths with equal seriousness ?

https://www.aic.gov.au/publications/tandi/tandi309

If Aboriginals had the same deaths in custody per capita of the population as non Aboriginals, then there should have only been 20 Aboriginal deaths, but according to your figures the was 145.

I think this is due to the higher rates of Aboriginals that end up in police custody, which again we had to look at the reasons for this.

As an Aboriginal person you are far more likely to end up in jail and there fore more likely to die there than a non aboriginal Australian.

 

[SirRumpole]

As an Aboriginal person you are far more likely to end up in jail and there fore more likely to die there than a non aboriginal Australian.

It's the opinion of some that this is all the white man's fault, but I think each side has to take responsibility.

 

[macca]

Perhaps the question we need to ask is WHY are there more Aboriginal people in gaol per capita than other races.

Perhaps the terrifying amount of domestic violence could have something to do with it

Then again it might be tribal, anyone who has been to Warburton WA will know what I mean there.

There are many towns in Oz that require a virtual fortress for the safety of the people staying there, walls 3m high are recommended !!

Yet other communities are fine, open road house, motel without a fence, no problems at all.

The Elders are just better in some places, dry communities are usually a Lot safer, cleaner and "normal" than open communities.

In some places the people voted for a dry community but one person complained to the Lawyers in Melbourne (you know the one, $15m per year from the Govt in legal aid) and the democratic decision was overturned by the court.

Rumour has it that there was few bumps and bruises doing the rounds after that (rumours only, probably not true just spread by those who voted dry )

 

[sptrawler]

Perhaps the question we need to ask is WHY are there more Aboriginal people in gaol per capita than other races.

Perhaps the terrifying amount of domestic violence could have something to do with it

Then again it might be tribal, anyone who has been to Warburton WA will know what I mean there.

There are many towns in Oz that require a virtual fortress for the safety of the people staying there, walls 3m high are recommended !!

Yet other communities are fine, open road house, motel without a fence, no problems at all.

The Elders are just better in some places, dry communities are usually a Lot safer, cleaner and "normal" than open communities.

In some places the people voted for a dry community but one person complained to the Lawyers in Melbourne (you know the one, $15m per year from the Govt in legal aid) and the democratic decision was overturned by the court.

Rumour has it that there was few bumps and bruises doing the rounds after that (rumours only, probably not true just spread by those who voted dry )

Just to highlight your statement:
Since 1989, the imprisonment rate of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people has increased 12 times faster than the rate for non-Aboriginal people. In December 2019 the rate was 2,536 prisoners per 100,000 adult Aboriginal population, compared to 218 prisoners per 100,000 non-Aboriginal population.

That is what needs to be addressed IMO, why are they committing so much crime and how do we turn it around.
As you have stated in earlier posts, the reason isn't rocket science, but it's the answers everyone avoids.
Too many city dweller elites deciding what needs doing, rather than listening to the aboriginals that want to turn it around.
Easier to just keep throwing money at the problem, than to face the reality.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians_and_crime

 

[Value Collector]

It's the opinion of some that this is all the white man's fault, but I think each side has to take responsibility.

I think when “white man” came and completely changed the world of the indigenous folks, we did take on a responsibility to help them adjust and adapt over the years and not let them fall behind.

I don’t believe we have done a great job of it.

 

[SirRumpole]

I think when “white man” came and completely changed the world of the indigenous folks, we did take on a responsibility to help them adjust and adapt over the years and not let them fall behind.

I don’t believe we have done a great job of it.

There will always be some indigenous leaders who don't want us to succeed because they don't want to thank the white man for anything and they will lose their credibility if they can't keep going on about the white man's neglect of indigenous people. Indigenous people already get twice the welfare per head than everyone else so how much do we have to do ?

 

[Value Collector]

There will always be some indigenous leaders who don't want us to succeed because they don't want to thank the white man for anything and they will lose their credibility if they can't keep going on about the white man's neglect of indigenous people. Indigenous people already get twice the welfare per head than everyone else so how much do we have to do ?

We have to do every thing we can until the basic measures of well being are raised to the level enjoyed by the rest of society.

I mean they weren’t even given the vote until 1960, and then for decades after that still suffered huge racial bias against them.

I think kids that come from stable homes, who’s parents can read and write, and hold good jobs will always do better than those That don’t.

Considering That the 30 year old aboriginals of today have parents who were raised in the 1970’s with all the trouble and obstacles and who’s parents were born in the 50’s etc,

There hasn’t been enough generations to build up a sound foundation of a culture that values modern education and that doesn’t face The negative affects of racism against them.

It’s a bit rough to expect them to more from what was essentially the Stone Age to getting good jobs in the city within a few generations, when the early years we as a society were actively pushing them away and shutting them out.

 

[mullokintyre]

You also need to look at what sort of transgressions are committed that cause people to end up in the clink. Lots of them are for unpaid fines, for crimes such as unregistered cars, no license, driving without a license or when its suspended, speeding, not wearing seatbelts, having unrestrained kids int car, etc etc. These are social crimes, and hardly worth the cost of incarceration. Yes there is a high level of domestic violence and assault, and that is an issue that faces all sections of the population. its just that indigenous people are more likely to go to jail for these crimes than the rest of us.

 

[qldfrog]

You also need to look at what sort of transgressions are committed that cause people to end up in the clink. Lots of them are for unpaid fines, for crimes such as unregistered cars, no license, driving without a license or when its suspended, speeding, not wearing seatbelts, having unrestrained kids int car, etc etc. These are social crimes, and hardly worth the cost of incarceration. Yes there is a high level of domestic violence and assault, and that is an issue that faces all sections of the population. its just that indigenous people are more likely to go to jail for these crimes than the rest of us.

There is some truth in the above but in no way explain the massive difference.why not pay fines straight from the welfare payment?
That would sort it out easily and may act as a deterrent.
What is a true statistical figure is that a white man in custody has more chance to die there than an aboriginal person.
chance being all relative obviously..
So the problem is not death in custody, the problem is disproportionate crime level among Aborigines.
I think any realistic adult can see the link with welfare and special status.
As for the tragedy of domestic violence, rape and abuse, the obvious solution removal of kids from affected households is now a no go.
So all that stolen generation movement ends up with beaten and raped kids,lives which are destroyed wo having had a decent chance as a direct result of this movement.
Responsabilities should be taken on both side.
Until a proper aboriginal leader gets up and spell this clear, welfare and reverse discrimination will carry on destroying whole generations..
A disgrace, these kids are real, not numbers

 

[Value Collector]

You also need to look at what sort of transgressions are committed that cause people to end up in the clink. Lots of them are for unpaid fines, for crimes such as unregistered cars, no license, driving without a license or when its suspended, speeding, not wearing seatbelts, having unrestrained kids int car, etc etc. These are social crimes, and hardly worth the cost of incarceration. Yes there is a high level of domestic violence and assault, and that is an issue that faces all sections of the population. its just that indigenous people are more likely to go to jail for these crimes than the rest of us.

Not to mention how often people of certain skin tones get let of with warnings etc where as others get the night in jail.

 

[SirRumpole]

Not to mention how often people of certain skin tones get let of with warnings etc where as others get the night in jail.

You can't just quote skin color , what about previous offences or warnings given ? That's the problem with this issue, we just don't have access to enough detail too determine whether people were justifiably detained or not.

 

[mullokintyre]

Jacinta price has a scathing attack on the BLM protesters.
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/aust...less-they-are-killed-by-white-men/ar-BB15cm7O
Aboriginal activist Jacinta Nampijinpa Price has slammed Black Lives Matter protesters as ignorant 'narcissists' who don't understand indigenous problems.

'Just watching the footage of protesters and the conversations around white privilege make me sick to my stomach,' she told Sky News.

'These are narcissists ... they don't have to do any hard work just appear as though they care.'

Ms Price, a Warlpiri woman and Alice Springs Town Councillor, said more Aboriginal people die outside of police custody than within it, with the majority of Aboriginal people killed and maimed by other Aboriginal people.


But because the violence is out of sight, out of mind, protesters don't care, she said.

'You don't care because the perpetrators are also black, and that's the big problem,' she said.

'People only care if there's seen to be a white perpetrator.'

According to the Australian Bureau of Statistics 2014–15 National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Social Survey, more than one in five or 22.3 per cent of all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people aged over 15 had experienced physical violence or threats in the previous 12 months.

 

[chiff]

Jacinta price has a scathing attack on the BLM protesters.
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/aust...less-they-are-killed-by-white-men/ar-BB15cm7O
Aboriginal activist Jacinta Nampijinpa Price has slammed Black Lives Matter protesters as ignorant 'narcissists' who don't understand indigenous problems.

'Just watching the footage of protesters and the conversations around white privilege make me sick to my stomach,' she told Sky News.

'These are narcissists ... they don't have to do any hard work just appear as though they care.'

Ms Price, a Warlpiri woman and Alice Springs Town Councillor, said more Aboriginal people die outside of police custody than within it, with the majority of Aboriginal people killed and maimed by other Aboriginal people.


But because the violence is out of sight, out of mind, protesters don't care, she said.

'You don't care because the perpetrators are also black, and that's the big problem,' she said.

'People only care if there's seen to be a white perpetrator.'

According to the Australian Bureau of Statistics 2014–15 National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Social Survey, more than one in five or 22.3 per cent of all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people aged over 15 had experienced physical violence or threats in the previous 12 months.

Isn't Jacinta Price the Liberal candidate?

 

[mullokintyre]

Isn't Jacinta Price the Liberal candidate?

yeah, I think she is. Does that exclude her from making comments about indigenous issues??

 

[chiff]

yeah, I think she is. Does that exclude her from making comments about indigenous issues??

Does not exclude her, but discounts her comments.This black deaths matter is more than that-it is about the plight of aboriginals overall,disadvantaged in a white man's society.What she says,and I suspect she knows it,is what suits her political aspirations.Has she anything constructive to say , or the old "What about you ,look over there argument".We are all hypocrites.I always like the political maxim 'if you can't win an argument stuff it up'

 

[mullokintyre]

Does not exclude her, but discounts her comments.This black deaths matter is more than that-it is about the plight of aboriginals overall,disadvantaged in a white man's society.What she says,and I suspect she knows it,is what suits her political aspirations.Has she anything constructive to say , or the old "What about you ,look over there argument".We are all hypocrites.I always like the political maxim 'if you can't win an argument stuff it up'

Why does it discount her comments? Firstly, she is Aboriginal. Secondly, she represents an area that has an Aboriginal population that makes up nearly 40% of the territory. Thirdly, she has provided stats from the ABS to back up what she says. Finally, if you must discount her because of her political aspirations, you would need to discount all politicians or people with political aspirations. I would have thought she has had something very constructive to say, namely that white elites protesting on behalf of Indigenous peoples are exactly what she says, a bunch of hyppocrites, no more, no less.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

="mullokintyre'".

welcome Mick

more brainfood here
nipper

 

[chiff]

Why does it discount her comments? Firstly, she is Aboriginal. Secondly, she represents an area that has an Aboriginal population that makes up nearly 40% of the territory. Thirdly, she has provided stats from the ABS to back up what she says. Finally, if you must discount her because of her political aspirations, you would need to discount all politicians or people with political aspirations. I would have thought she has had something very constructive to say, namely that white elites protesting on behalf of Indigenous peoples are exactly what she says, a bunch of hyppocrites, no more, no less.

As I see it ,she has very little credibility amongst other aboriginals ,and representative aboriginal groups.She has her own agenda.Did she say anything contructive ?You cannot be captain of a football team if you have not got the respect of the rest of the team.