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- 10 February 2006
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Can i just say **** ME. That is an amazing example. I think you would find the problem these days is people are interested in what can happen in 2 days not 40 years. But man o man, what an investment.
I am not schooled in fundamentals. I wonder how easy/hard it is to pick up on something like that. I imagine it would take alot of research and following the companies in speculation on there progress.
Anyone who invested $500 (actually pounds in those days) in 1960, reinvested for 40 years, would by 2000 made $109m. That's 36% compounded annual return.
Well done BunyipVery well done
Re: "Which one do you use? Technical or fundamental analysis"
Do you cover one eye when you drive your car?
Do you use only one pedal when riding a bike?
Why not use all the tools at your disposal?
Technical analysis is a good way to find new stocks/ companies that you may not have been aware of & get in ahead of the crowd.
Finding new companies with good Fundamentals often means reading a report ie- the sheep are already aware of it.
TA is good for making entries & exits ie making a buck shorter term
FA is the retirement accumulation way of patiently building a nest egg.
Different strokes for different folks.
Personally I am much more dependant on TA because I don't have a steady income stream for investing long term but I never buy a share without checking the basic fundamentals.
Hey Bunyip great arguments.....makes a lot of sense and I totally agree with your way of thinking about being stuck in dogs whil you could have the money working.....
It was challenged that WDC is a dog and it clearly is not.......Its a fantastic stock in a rut, currently massively oversold.....but oversold on a short term good reason....
Love your poetry......you have too much time...
The tricky one is the up-trending share price with terrible company fundamentals.
Hi everyone,
I just did a course at uni which solely focused on fundamental analysis to value stocks. I have been searching for historical data so I can compute a market return. The S&P website only has total returns for the past 5 years. If I were to calculate the geometric return for the past 10 to 25 years it yields a result lower than the risk free rate.
What market return do you use in your models when you are calculating cost of equity?
I know you can't rely on these models, I just want to apply the knowledge I have learnt.
Thanks for anyone who answers my newbie question
I think that's more common in smaller stocks whose prices are prone to being moved by rumour, rather than by solid fundamentals.
Good luck! Doubt you'll find much applicable knowledge from 60year old professors, teaching 80 year old theories.
Finance.yahoo.com has longer term stuff eg. ^AXJO is our index, historical goes back quite far.
Based on the research estimates I've seen, market risk premium for US equity ranges from 4.5% to 5.5%, which looks reasonable to me in a low interest rate environment.I plan on studying/reading as much material on investing before I start. I just want to know what market risk premium to use.
It's a load of croc really. If you weren't involved in a company as a partner, and you invested $500 back then, which would have been a reasonable sum, and you managed to turn that in to $10,000 you would likely sell. If you could turn it into a 100K you'd almost certainly liquidate in a major bear market to lock in your profits. If you turned it into a million dollars and started to see your equity fluctuate by many tens of thousands of dollars you couldn't sleep at night. if you turned it into 100 mill and then watched your equity swing by tens of millions during corrections - well no human could tolerate that in reality: thats suicidal territory.
Yeh, 36% compounded return is a good performance for a large company.
Considerably better than Buffet gets.
But realistically, similar returns or better are available year in year out to trend traders who know what they're doing - even in bear markets.....IF they're willing to go short as well as long.
If you are thinking in the perspective of a short term technical traders, then you will never hold on to a stock for 40 years.
If you are a fundamentalist however, then you should be forward looking, not looking back at how much you've paid or how much you've made. If the company has significant growth prospects then you hold on to your shares.
And, if your holding is in fact in the millions, then why would you care about day to day fluctuations of a few $Ks? No body says that it will be easy, but just because you can't easily do it doesn't mean it isn't doable...
Agree, $20shoes.Even being exposed to one security with millions at play would not even be remotely feasible for 99.9% of investors. The fear of losing it would be too great and your health and lifestyle would be adversely affected by the precarious position you'd believe your wealth is in.
I combine both fundamental and technical analysis, at first I choose some stocks with fundamental analysis then with technical analysis decide when trade them.
Any true Fundamental investor can not use Technical analysis...
I think I'd have to disagree with you realist, maybe they wouldn't use it to trade per se but i think it is useful to identify companies that might be undervalued for analysis
If you are thinking in the perspective of a short term technical traders, then you will never hold on to a stock for 40 years.
It's a load of croc really. If you weren't involved in a company as a partner, and you invested $500 back then, which would have been a reasonable sum, and you managed to turn that in to $10,000 you would likely sell.
Interesting logic.
A charts price reflects the markets perception of its share price at that point in time.Regardless of wether you or 100 analysts value the share at even remotely the same core valuation.
Its not possible to even get 2 people agreeing on a valuation let alone 10,000 share holders,as can be seen by fluctuations in price.
If it was that easy to value a company then the share price would be stoic.
So here we go again whose perception of valuation is correct the fundamentalist or the technical analysts.
Fact remains that either has to see price rise above their BUY price REGARDLESS of analysis method or method of entry.
I'm not so sure that a fundamentalist could hold on for much more than a multibagger. In fact, I know that the pressure to take money off the table would be be too overwhelming for 99% of fundamentalists out there. In fact, I know a lot of fundamentalists who get shaken out of their positions readily as market sentiment shifts.
If I were overexposed in one stock, that was worth millions and the GFC was just starting to kick in, my equity wouldn't just be rippling...you'd typically be talking swings in a bear market of hundreds of thousands....why would you hold through that??...not many could hold through the mind play that would ensue. Human psychology would not let you.. you'd either be smart and sell at the top or finally break and sell at the bottom or at least attempt to average down to compensate.
Even being exposed to one security with millions at play would not even be remotely feasible for 99.9% of investors. The fear of losing it would be too great and your health and lifestyle would be adversely affected by the precarious position you'd believe your wealth is in.
Would love to hear from investors who have been overexposed in one stock, and how they dealt or didn't deal with it - particularly form a human psych point of view. I'm sure there are some who can take the exposure, but I'd say you're a rare breed.
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