US Election - Where Do You Stand?

Donald Trump seems to represent the worst the US has to offer.

If they elect him, my opinion of the US as a society will be at rock bottom.

The movie "the Campaign" with Will Ferrell is worth a good watch when considering US politics

Tisme said:

The movie "the Campaign" with Will Ferrell is worth a good watch when considering US politics

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Pretty funny.
It's much smarter than I thought it was.


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Hilary Clinton caring for the little guys. Even her delivery looks fake.

Knowing some basic fact about her and Bill's earnings after their time in office kind of rub me the wrong way hearing these fluff.

She once earned something like $800,000 per day... that's per day for two half hour speeches she gave at some association of this or that industry. They make $20 million last year from just speeches.

If that's not legalised bribery, hard to know what is.

I've been to hear one of these people's lectures and even in year 12 back then they aren't that insightful.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGerWRb5_ms

How did i miss this the first time around?

Anyway - Hillary 89% and Bernie 88%

Ben Carson is passing Trump.
He's a bit weird.

Some of his quotes:

The military should not be subject to any war crimes law.
Women who get abortions are like slaveholders
Jews could have prevented the Holocaust if they had guns
College campuses should be monitored for liberal political speech
There’s a war on ‘what’s inside of women’ not on women.
Congress should be able to remove judges for voting for marriage equality

If it's a choice between this joker and Trump, then I want Trump.

Knobby22 said:

Ben Carson is passing Trump.
He's a bit weird.

Some of his quotes:

The military should not be subject to any war crimes law.
Women who get abortions are like slaveholders
Jews could have prevented the Holocaust if they had guns
College campuses should be monitored for liberal political speech
There’s a war on ‘what’s inside of women’ not on women.
Congress should be able to remove judges for voting for marriage equality

If it's a choice between this joker and Trump, then I want Trump.

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Hilary is going to win.

Her strategy now seems to say the same stuff Bernie Sanders have been saying - Wall St bad! CEO earns too much; working class people are suffering - then add on top her experience under Bill [who deregulate the financial system, private prisons, three-strikes rules and wars on drugs] and under Obama as Sec of State taking on the world.... all while Bernie take naps or something.

A lot of US voters are ticked off with Pres Obama, which would appear to be Trump's best chance.

Voters might just think '..the hell with it, let's get a Republican back in the Oval Office.'

H.Clinton, like liverwurst, looks a manufactured product to me, not that Trump is much better.

Logique said:

A lot of US voters are ticked off with Pres Obama, which would appear to be Trump's best chance.

Voters might just think '..the hell with it, let's get a Republican back in the Oval Office.'

H.Clinton, like liverwurst, looks a manufactured product to me, not that Trump is much better.

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Yea Trump, and maybe Bernie Sanders, are the only ones that look genuine. Too bad Trump is an incompetent racist with no clue about anything but himself and his hair.

Knobby22 said:

Ben Carson is passing Trump.
He's a bit weird.

Some of his quotes:

The military should not be subject to any war crimes law.
Women who get abortions are like slaveholders
Jews could have prevented the Holocaust if they had guns
College campuses should be monitored for liberal political speech
There’s a war on ‘what’s inside of women’ not on women.
Congress should be able to remove judges for voting for marriage equality

If it's a choice between this joker and Trump, then I want Trump.

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Can't believe Carson is actually a world reknown neurosurgeon. wtf?

luutzu said:

Hilary is going to win.

Her strategy now seems to say the same stuff Bernie Sanders have been saying - Wall St bad! CEO earns too much; working class people are suffering - then add on top her experience under Bill [who deregulate the financial system, private prisons, three-strikes rules and wars on drugs] and under Obama as Sec of State taking on the world.... all while Bernie take naps or something.

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This is why the US' economic hegemony is/will be supplanted by the Chinese (and eventually others) and it's role as an economic powerhouse on the wane. The changing demographics (aided and abetted by the Democrats themselves) promulgating an ailing and decrepit economy and politik to match the worst of the Eurozone.

They have become a parody of themselves, followed closely by the rest of the anglosphere.

wayneL said:

This is why the US' economic hegemony is/will be supplanted by the Chinese (and eventually others) and it's role as an economic powerhouse on the wane. The changing demographics (aided and abetted by the Democrats themselves) promulgating an ailing and decrepit economy and politik to match the worst of the Eurozone.

They have become a parody of themselves, followed closely by the rest of the anglosphere.

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All very well but they still have considerable power and I prefer them to China and Russia, even though they are beginning to look more like a totalitarian country what with all the spying on their own citizens (and us).

wayneL said:

This is why the US' economic hegemony is/will be supplanted by the Chinese (and eventually others) and it's role as an economic powerhouse on the wane. The changing demographics (aided and abetted by the Democrats themselves) promulgating an ailing and decrepit economy and politik to match the worst of the Eurozone.

They have become a parody of themselves, followed closely by the rest of the anglosphere.

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It's not refugees or Mexican illegals that's causing the US and Europe economic decline, or changing its character for the worst. It's these hollow, manufactured, faux democracy that's causing its decline.

Illegals in the US get no welfare; refugees I heard only get six months and then very little else. So they have to work, and they do work - working at jobs no Americans want, being paid at illegal wages and definitely not receiving any benefits like health insurance or healthcare.

So you can't pin the US economic woes on illegals or refugees or immigrants.

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What's causing these economic declines start with its politics. I heard some 60% of Americans don't bother to vote - most of them know the game is rigged. For everyone else there's hope for change... and hope is all they get every four years.

You have a billionaire like Trump saying crazy stuff and blaming Mexicans and some American love that kind of "honesty"; You get Bobby Jindal, an Indian-American whose parents was Indian on a work visa and gave birth to him in the US so he has his US citizenship and using that got his parents and family over to the US... you get a guy like that saying if he became president he'll repeal that part of the constitution that permit anchor babies like himself; or Carson the brain surgeon who we think ought to be a bit clever than average saying crazy stuff and going against his past recommendation on abortion in cases where the child has genetic defect etc....

Then there's Hilary, Jeb... they're practically two dynasty all speaking as though they're feel the average joe's pain and know what it's like to budget like struggling families do around kitchen tables blah di da...

It's all political theatre that's on show once every four years, after which the party and the candidate with the best looking and most convincing speeches win. Then it's just business as usual where Wall St get bail out and main st get the shaft.

On these terms, it's very similar to China. Only difference is in China the senior comrades get their children and relatives to own important companies and partnerships whereas in the US and Western democracies the senior leadership only get cushy jobs and speaking fees after they leave office and their children only get measly scholarships and high figured starting salaries.

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Why the US might lose to China in the South China Seas could be due to the influence of US corporations hampering its foreign policy.

Too much investment has been made in China by the multinationals so you cannot sanction or otherwise weaken or ruin China's economies; And you can't take it over either because the bastards got nuke... so you wait and see and play around in the ME and viola, three Chinese airstrips in the middle of the world's busiest trade routes with abundant resources and great strategic signifant... and you can't do nothing about it with losing those multi-nationals billions or trillions.

So you'd have to do trade deals with other Asian tigers, slowly enabling the corps to move their assets and divest interests to friendlier countries... by the time your corps managed enough diversification, China might already control the whole dam sphere and with a hundred or two hundred million new Chinese coming by then, starting a couple war of conquest doesn't sound that detrimental to economic growth and progress.

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I haven't look at the studies but if we look at Australia or the US after WW2... the two countries were flooded with a lot of refugees and poor migrants from all over Europe and part of the ME. How or why did those refugees and poor migrants escaping the old and half decimated world not ruin but contribute to its economies?

We can say it's because of their Christian values if we want... It's more of the case that after WW2, wealth and income equality were not so extreme as they have become. With more money in more hands, economies have more demand and more investment and more revenue etc. Giving money to the very rich and they just buy more villas overseas and more holiday to exotic places, and what's left they speculate in financial games...


Anyway, it's easy to blame the poor and the foreign funny sounding and scary looking people for our woes... countries and economies have collapsed perfectly fine without feeding the poor or the hungry refugees.

Oh FFS luutzu.

Why when I say demographics, do you think race/refugees?

FYI, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/demographics

I suggest further study on this topic for you grasshopper.

wayneL said:

Oh FFS luutzu.

Why when I say demographics, do you think race/refugees?

FYI, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/demographics

I suggest further study on this topic for you grasshopper.

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Yes Master Sensei , [sensai is Japanese for 'master']

from the link:

adjective, Also, demographical
1. of or relating to demography, the science of vital and social statistics.
noun
2. a single vital or social statistic of a human population, as the number of births or deaths.
3. a specific segment of a population having shared characteristics: The producers were looking for a show that would appeal to the 18-34 demographic.

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So what demographics do you mean?

It can't be age and it can't be median income. So I conclude you mean race/refugees and its changing demographics.

Can't be age because China has an aging problem (one-child policy gone on for too long);

Can't be the middle-class demo problem because the US middle/average income is still much much higher than China's.

SirRumpole said:

All very well but they still have considerable power and I prefer them to China and Russia, even though they are beginning to look more like a totalitarian country what with all the spying on their own citizens (and us).

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If China or Russia takes over, and if we survived it, either one of them will do and act exactly as the US has been since WW2 - peace keeping

Given Australia's history, we'd probably be on the side of the US and if either of the other two win, we're stuffed because those peace keeping missions will be conducted on this Southern land.

luutzu said:

Yes Master Sensei , [sensai is Japanese for 'master']

from the link:


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So what demographics do you mean?

It can't be age and it can't be median income. So I conclude you mean race/refugees and its changing demographics.

Can't be age because China has an aging problem (one-child policy gone on for too long);

Can't be the middle-class demo problem because the US middle/average income is still much much higher than China's.

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Sigh! Demographics is the study of all those things, yes race/religion is a part of that, but not the whole. See, you have not taken my advice grasshopper and thoroughly learned this dark art.

BTW luutzu, seeing as the setting was a Chinese Taoist monastry, the proper title is Sifu, if you please.

Where do i stand?

Well, its bloody stupid when the best cnadidate, (the incubent) cant even run.

wayneL said:

Sigh! Demographics is the study of all those things, yes race/religion is a part of that, but not the whole. See, you have not taken my advice grasshopper and thoroughly learned this dark art.

BTW luutzu, seeing as the setting was a Chinese Taoist monastry, the proper title is Sifu, if you please.

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As always, you are right Master Sifu. [4 years of Japanese and I only know a few words, might as well make use of it where you can Though sensai was probably from TMNT, heroes in a hard shell]

Forgive thy arrogance but thy grasshopper have heard it said that "he who know not but speak is not wise; he who know but not speak is not loyal". Thus, before we proceed towards learning the art of knowing nothingness and thereby achieve wisdom; dare I, a humble and lowly grasshopper, risk showing his foolishness but also his loyalty, speak upon your premise and its conclusion?

Since the end of the war of All-under-Heaven, part two, the Empire of the United States alone stood tall and with its three army in tact, a few dozen weapons of the gods in the shed: abroad it establishes new standards, new borders and new spheres of nations to serve its hegemony; at home it instituted free higher education for its returned warriors and also to the hundred families, invest in the national highway, railway and other infrastructure and nation-building projects and endeavours - thereby training its sons and daughters, rewarding its soldiers and enriching the hundred families.

With the war to end all wars, part two, having drained its treasuries and depleted many of its young blood; having had to welcome and resettle millions of the poor and devastated people of the old world... how was it that this Western Empire manages to not merely feed, house and accessorise its people with riches but managed to export the excess capabilities throughout the four corners of the Earth?

How has it managed to maintain such national unity among the many cultures and people who pledge allegiance to it; attract the brightest and the most ambitious to its shores, and continue to grow itself and lift the world along with it for three decades?

From such height it then slowly decline to where it could "no longer afford" free nor cheap education for its young so indebted them with seriously screwed up amount of debt; could not afford paying a living wage to its workers whose jobs have jet to be exported offshore; could not afford, so it is claimed, to heal its old, its sick and its dying even though it spent twice as much per capita compare to former colony and current imperial outpost like Australia.

Why such decay and decline that its leadership talks of throwing the poor and grandma out the window and let the invisible hand deal with her.

Could this decline be due to worshiping a god with the invisible hand since the 1980s; of enacting policies that enriches the very few at the expense of the many. Could it be due to its leaders giving fine speeches to the common people to then enjoy fine dinning where the cost of entry reaches a year or two their average son's wages.

With still abundant natural resources of its own, and more resources from "friends" abroad, why are most American working harder but getting poorer while some barely lift a finger yet earn more each day than what they know what to waste it on.

Are the blood flowing through these American veins not the same of their forefathers? Are the immigrants and illegals not having the same wide-eyed dreams of America being that shiny city on the hill? So Sifu, what the hell?

Thy disciple, therefore, put it to you Sifu, that the decline of the American empire is due not to its demographics but to other very human forces manipulating the rules and rigging the game.

Ah you are thoughtful grasshopper.

The points you raise fine points indeed. The sage never asks such questions from the position of having already made a conclusion. Your questions correct, the sponsoring thoughts from whence they originated entirely wrong, ergo the conclusion wrong.

Focus grasshopper, perform 300 push ups on your left pinky as you contemplate this and reverse the process. Ask the question first, eschew erroneous ideological conclusions and expect a Damascus Road epiphany.

For your edification, I expect a 5,000 word essay by tomorrow.

wayneL said:

Ah you are thoughtful grasshopper.

The points you raise fine points indeed. The sage never asks such questions from the position of having already made a conclusion. Your questions correct, the sponsoring thoughts from whence they originated entirely wrong, ergo the conclusion wrong.

Focus grasshopper, perform 300 push ups on your left pinky as you contemplate this and reverse the process. Ask the question first, eschew erroneous ideological conclusions and expect a Damascus Road epiphany.

For your edification, I expect a 5,000 word essay by tomorrow.

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I hear you Sifu...

But... Perhaps the air is too thin up this high; the water too foul. A reminder that perhaps one ought to be mindful following the wandering Eagle?

May I suggest we descent the mountain to where the air is warm and bottled water is always at hand.