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Is cryptocurrency the greatest market bubble of all time?

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I'm no fan of cryptocurrencies, but it's interesting the way that the powers that be (high profile corporate types, politicians, bureaucrats, and now institutions) continue to undermine cryptocurrencies, particular Bitcoin, in an ongoing attempt to remove confidence and spook the crypto market.
Tend to agree with the BOE that anyone speculating in crypto should be prepared to lose, if not everything, then most of their funds. I don't agree though that Bitcoin is potentially worthless, just not worth anywhere near the price it's trading at. More troubling for crypto speculators is the hidden messaging from such a powerful financial institution. Does it signal tighter regulatory oversight is coming or something even more drastic being considered behind the boardroom doors of the world's largest financial institutions and central banks?
 

StockyGuy

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Tend to agree with the BOE that anyone speculating in crypto should be prepared to lose, if not everything, then most of their funds. I don't agree though that Bitcoin is potentially worthless, just not worth anywhere near the price it's trading at. More troubling for crypto speculators is the hidden messaging from such a powerful financial institution. Does it signal tighter regulatory oversight is coming or something even more drastic being considered behind the boardroom doors of the world's largest financial institutions and central banks?

Yep, fair warning has been given. As if the China and India crypto "warnings" weren't enough. I assume anyone with ears to hear who's made serious money (never have to work again sort of money) in these Ponzi/pyramid scheme devil spawn contraptions has by now safely moved away enough profit to proper assets, or even just a real currency, such that they're all good either way, come what may, to their crypto play (sorry for the rhyme).
 
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Making money out of thin air. Go Meta!!


A millennial NFT investor made nearly $100,000 in 6 months with a virtual car repair shop and a bank in a gaming metaverse that isn't even live yet


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Camomile Shumba
Dec. 19, 2021, 07:45 AM


A snapshot from The Sandbox virtual metaverse
The Sandbox

The metaverse has grown astronomically over the past few weeks, with people spending millions of dollars on virtual land. Investors like 37-year old Robert Doyle are already making money out of those assets.

Doyle owns a virtual car-repair shop and a bank in a metaverse that isn't even fully live yet and he's made almost $100,000 in six months, according to crypto wallets shown to Insider.

Polka City, where Doyle's virtual property sits, is a metaverse gaming platform that launched in 2021. Players can buy non-fungible tokens that represent virtual taxis, gas stations, billboards and even motorcycles. They then earn weekly interest paid in the platform's native token.

 
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Why the world’s first bitcoin city is a disaster in the making

His bitcoin experiment has largely failed but El Salvador’s fast-talking president says the answer is more bitcoin.

"Salvadoran President Nayib Bukele’s experiment in making bitcoin an official national currency alongside the US dollar, which has been the currency since 2001, has not gone well. But when a con artist’s grift starts to fall apart, he knows to move onto the next one fast. The same goes for fast-talking presidents.

More than 91 percent of Salvadorans want dollars, not bitcoins. The official Chivo payment system was unreliable at launch in September—the kiss of death for a new system. Users joined for the $US30 sign-up bonus, spent it or cashed it out, then did not use Chivo again.

The system completely failed to check new users’ photos, relying solely on their national identity card number and date of birth; massive identity fraud to steal sign-up bonuses ensued. Bitcoin’s ridiculously volatile price was appreciated only by aspiring day traders.

Large street protests against compulsory bitcoin implementation continued through October. The government stopped promoting Chivo on radio, TV, and social media. Chivo buses and vans were seen with plastic taped over the company’s logo."


A disaster is unfolding in impoverished El Salvador where it's citizens are being used as guinea pigs by a whacky quasi dictator betting the country's future on the forced adoption of crypto "currency" as legal tender in a dollarized economy. Hailed, lauded and facilitated by Bitcoin maximalists (desperate to see this long odds experiment succeed) as a bold move and example to follow, this has to be one of the crueler monetary hoaxes perpetrated at the level of a sovereign country. No doubt when this experiment fails, the Bitcoin community will blame the failure on everything other than Bitcoin's unsuitability as legal tender (a use for which it was never intended).
 
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moXJO

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Making money out of thin air. Go Meta!!


A millennial NFT investor made nearly $100,000 in 6 months with a virtual car repair shop and a bank in a gaming metaverse that isn't even live yet


View attachment 134577

Camomile Shumba
Dec. 19, 2021, 07:45 AM


A snapshot from The Sandbox virtual metaverse
The Sandbox

The metaverse has grown astronomically over the past few weeks, with people spending millions of dollars on virtual land. Investors like 37-year old Robert Doyle are already making money out of those assets.

Doyle owns a virtual car-repair shop and a bank in a metaverse that isn't even fully live yet and he's made almost $100,000 in six months, according to crypto wallets shown to Insider.

Polka City, where Doyle's virtual property sits, is a metaverse gaming platform that launched in 2021. Players can buy non-fungible tokens that represent virtual taxis, gas stations, billboards and even motorcycles. They then earn weekly interest paid in the platform's native token.

Early adopters generally make the money. Games often lose steam once they get mainstreamed.
 

bluekelah

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IMHO Cryptocurrencies aren't worth much really, though the platforms they run on can be useful. However due to unregulated nature its best used for money laundering and other dodgy money transfers. And if they get regulated, then they lose most of their function as you dont really have "private ownership" of the asset anymore since gov can track it and tax it.

Any token on any platform can just easily be replaced by a digital USD, u just have to rename the token to USD. Even coles or woolies or qantas rewards points can be run on a blockchain type platform and become cryptos and be traded on the exchanges and even have futures trading on them. Would that increase their price? yes probably. but would it make them anymore useful or valuable? probably not...

Since NFTs/Crypto doesnt have much mainstream use in commerce yet, their value is really tied to how much easy credit/speculation is out there in the market. It is easy to observe every time the FED tightens like its tapering since mid-Nov, all the risky money flows out of crypto first really, then stocks. So you can expect as rate rises, Cryptos will crashes....

The software companies behind the cryptos are actually like unregulated banks.govs creating their own fiat currency. Just look at Bitcoin, it already has a few forks as founders and members disagree on how they wanna run the "company"
 

orr

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'A modest proposal' One of the all time greatest satirical pieces ever written, was accepteted as the title intended by many of the British parliment of the day.
In the Satirical great tradition Trey Parker and Matt Stone work their craft... "Crypto-Curious" .
To live and walk the earth with these giants is an honour.
'
 
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'A modest proposal' One of the all time greatest satirical pieces ever written, was accepteted as the title intended by many of the British parliment of the day.
In the Satirical great tradition Trey Parker and Matt Stone work their craft... "Crypto-Curious" .
To live and walk the earth with these giants is an honour.
'

Is this the clip that came with your post Orr.

 

orr

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That's most of it Bas ... The Victor Chaos origin story .... If you haven't seen it already, does the set up.
 
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One of the main stays of Crypto trading is the use of stable coins as an intermediate currency. Tether is one of major stable coins. It has issued $78Billion of coinage allegedly backed up by US dollars. But who is counting ?

Is Tether a $48 billion scam?

https://medium.com/@sreverre?source=post_page-----4e8af1bedf76-----------------------------------
0*RbKdm6CkoETkx-Qs.jpg
Stéphane Reverre
Follow

Apr 20 · 6 min read
Well….

1*Rq5OBy5tl0XB00f2ZfFlyA.jpg
For those who follow the Tether story, there’s been a recent development worth mentioning: the publication of an audit of Tether reserves by a third-party. The statement is available for download on their front page. Tether does have a page with a statement of account (here), but as it is unaudited and uncertified it is not worth much.

There’s been a lot of discussion about whether Tether is a scam of gigantic proportion, but overall those suspicions have had little effect on the rhythm of issuance, reaching today almost $48 bln judging by the latest official figures on coinmarket cap. The immediate and intuitive reaction to this figure is that it’s too big to be anything but real. How could one possibly get away with a scheme of that magnitude?

Unfortunately, it has happened in the past: Madoff (estimated losses $18 bln), Parmalat (when the scandal broke $4 bln were missing), Wirecard ($1.9 bln missing), Enron ($40 bln bankrupcy case following a corporate Ponzi scheme for more than 10 years, during which Enron was celebrated as one of the most innovative US companies). No, size is no guarantee of legitimacy or righteousness.

 
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Cryptocurrency has a direct impact on the pricing of gadgets.
Payback periods for most NVIDIA models have exceeded 20 months, and RTX 3000 cards without LHR under current conditions will return on investment for more than 22 months. The AMD Radeon RX 5000/6000 graphics cards perform slightly better which will return on investment in 19 months. However, due to the plans of the Ethereum Foundation, miners will not have so much time to return their investments, because the transition to Ethereum 2.0 may happen in the next 4-6 months. All this makes the purchase of new farms an extremely hopeless activity and can positively affect the prices and availability of graphics adapters in 2022.
 
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Cryptocurrency has a direct impact on the pricing of gadgets.
Expanding on this, crypto (Bitcoin in particular) consumes vast amounts of energy (greater than entire countries) to validate transactions on the blockchain and generates enormous e-waste and greenhouse gas emissions in the process. Considering Bitcoin has no intrinsic value, very limited utility and primarily hoarded because its "scarcity" has an insane price attached to it, the enormous waste from such human folly is an economic and ecological tragedy. Musk is the only whale (via Tesla) who has shown any real initiative to call out such waste and drag a reluctant Bitcoin community into a discussion of such issues. All talk and little action is the likely outcome.
 

over9k

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Expanding on this, crypto (Bitcoin in particular) consumes vast amounts of energy (greater than entire countries) to validate transactions on the blockchain and generates enormous e-waste and greenhouse gas emissions in the process. Considering Bitcoin has no intrinsic value, very limited utility and primarily hoarded because its "scarcity" has an insane price attached to it, the enormous waste from such human folly is an economic and ecological tragedy. Musk is the only whale (via Tesla) who has shown any real initiative to call out such waste and drag a reluctant Bitcoin community into a discussion of such issues. All talk and little action is the likely outcome.
Musk used it as an excuse to manipulate the market.
 

Sean K

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Has it started to happen, or is gold a better store of value?

Hopes of Bitcoin becoming credible slump with it's price
The OZ
By Simon Nixon

One of the boldest claims advanced to justify the remarkable rise in the value of bitcoin towards the end of last year was that the digital currency was set to rival gold as a long-term store of value.

Indeed, Goldman Sachs even cited these supposed inflation-proof qualities as justification for its eye-catching prediction at the end of last year that bitcoin could hit $US100,000 ($140,000) over the next five years. The investment bank noted that the cryptocurrency already accounted for 20 per cent of what it called the “store of value” market, comprising gold and bitcoin, and suggested that this could rise above 50 per cent.

That prediction has not survived its first contact with economic reality. As the world’s big economies grapple with the highest inflation in decades, the price of bitcoin has tumbled. It stands at $US37,563, more than 40 per cent below its November peak. Meanwhile, the price of gold is broadly unchanged since the start of the year, suggesting that bitcoin’s share of the “store of value” market is down to about 10 per cent.

It turns out that far from trading like gold, bitcoin has more in common with technology stocks, which similarly soared when central banks flooded markets with cheap money but have sunk at the first hint of a rate rise.

Indeed, the crypto boom has carried all the hallmarks of a bubble. The number of digital currencies has exploded in recent years, rising from 6000 to more than 11,000 last year. At its peak, the combined market capitalisation of the crypto universe was an estimated $US2.6 trillion.
 

Garpal Gumnut

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Has it started to happen, or is gold a better store of value?

Hopes of Bitcoin becoming credible slump with it's price
The OZ
By Simon Nixon

One of the boldest claims advanced to justify the remarkable rise in the value of bitcoin towards the end of last year was that the digital currency was set to rival gold as a long-term store of value.

Indeed, Goldman Sachs even cited these supposed inflation-proof qualities as justification for its eye-catching prediction at the end of last year that bitcoin could hit $US100,000 ($140,000) over the next five years. The investment bank noted that the cryptocurrency already accounted for 20 per cent of what it called the “store of value” market, comprising gold and bitcoin, and suggested that this could rise above 50 per cent.

That prediction has not survived its first contact with economic reality. As the world’s big economies grapple with the highest inflation in decades, the price of bitcoin has tumbled. It stands at $US37,563, more than 40 per cent below its November peak. Meanwhile, the price of gold is broadly unchanged since the start of the year, suggesting that bitcoin’s share of the “store of value” market is down to about 10 per cent.

It turns out that far from trading like gold, bitcoin has more in common with technology stocks, which similarly soared when central banks flooded markets with cheap money but have sunk at the first hint of a rate rise.

Indeed, the crypto boom has carried all the hallmarks of a bubble. The number of digital currencies has exploded in recent years, rising from 6000 to more than 11,000 last year. At its peak, the combined market capitalisation of the crypto universe was an estimated $US2.6 trillion.
Thanks @Sean K . Just an update on the BTC : GOLD conversion chart.

This illustrates your point. This is now the only BTC chart I follow, found on duckduckgo by inputting XE BTC GOLD.

BTC is seen to be losing value to gold. 1 bitcoin buys just 20 oz gold. In Nov. 21 it bought 37.

Crypto is behaving less like a store of value and more like a tulip.

Where is it's value in a crisis, what can one do with it...?

Screen Shot 2022-02-03 at 7.25.51 pm.png



gg
 

Sean K

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Thanks @Sean K . Just an update on the BTC : GOLD conversion chart.

This illustrates your point. This is now the only BTC chart I follow, found on duckduckgo by inputting XE BTC GOLD.

BTC is seen to be losing value to gold. 1 bitcoin buys just 20 oz gold. In Nov. 21 it bought 37.

Crypto is behaving less like a store of value and more like a tulip.

Where is it's value in a crisis, what can one do with it...?

View attachment 137002



gg

Seems tulip-like, but is it too early days to say? The short term volatility makes me think it's very speculative. PMs have gone though peaks and troughs too though, I suppose. All the market is speculation on future value to some degree. Hence pe ratios. There's tech stocks on 150% pe's in the US at the moment...
 
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All the market is speculation on future value to some degree. Hence pe ratios. There's tech stocks on 150% pe's in the US at the moment...
Evidence that value and price are disconnected more now than at anytime in history perhaps especially in crypto land? How would someone establish a future value for Bitcoin or any other alt coin, there is nothing on which you can base a future valuation, no interest, no earnings, no intrinsic value etc. Crypto acts primarily as a proxy for holding/storing fiat currency instead of traditional banking. Yet somehow a ridiculous price exists for say Bitcoin that is almost entirely based on assumptions around a higher future price that must come to fruition because of engineered scarcity and imagined superior utility! Crypto "investing" is more than just speculation, it's an online casino where bets are being placed but you have no idea about the odds of winning. Calling it gambling then is a misnomer, it's a transfer of wealth from the naïve to the crypto shills.
 
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This story makes sense in so many ways.:speechless:

Bitcoin paradise? Briton creates ‘crypto utopia’ in South Pacific

Anthony Welch and partner try to woo cryptocurrency investors to regulation-free island on Vanuatu archipelago
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Vanuatu is a South Pacific Ocean nation made up of approximately 80 islands. Photograph: Westend61/Getty Images

Rupert-Neate,-L.png
Rupert Neate Wealth correspondent

@RupertNeate
Sat 12 Feb 2022 18.00 AEDT

For the past 12 years Anthony Welch and his partner Theresa have been living a Robinson Crusoe life alone on a South Pacific island mostly untouched by humanity.
Welch, a retired British property investor, hopes the tranquility will soon be shattered by 21,000 cryptocurrency investors he is trying to convince to move to his island and form a regulation-free “crypto utopia”.

Under Welch’s plan, the 3,000 square metre (32,000 sq ft) island (!!?) , (actually it's 800 acres. See video) which is part of the Vanuatu archipelago between Australia and Fiji, would be transformed from 90% undisturbed rainforest into a “sustainable smart city”, filled with multistorey apartment blocks and offices for cryptocurrency investors from around the world.

 
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For those who follow the NFL Super Bowl (now being dubbed the "Crypto Bowl"), there are many millions being spent on crypto advertising for this event. It will be interesting to see if this generates the desired pump and dump event many whales, crypto exchanges and promotors are betting on to turn the tide of the downtrend. One of the greatest con jobs in human history hijacks a major sporting event...
https://www.wired.com/story/crypto-super-bowl/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...g-super-bowl-by-giving-away-millions-bitcoin/
 
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there are many millions being spent on crypto advertising for this event.
Just an observation but in the course of normal use of the internet, reading serious content online and so on something is really standing out.

Whenever the subject at hand is hijacked by comments that are in no way related, at a rough estimate 75% of the time the nature of that hijack is "you should buy cryptocurrencies". That crops up in all sorts of places, even serious ones like engineering or scientific things through to totally non-serious YouTube videos in the comments. If someone hijacks then the vast majority of the time they're pushing crypto's.

My assumption is that's not part of any coordinated effort but simply that there's rather a lot of people who are totally enamoured with the whole thing and think they're doing everyone a favour by telling them about this "can't go wrong" opportunity.

That alone is extremely bubble-like in nature. :2twocents
 
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