Australian Job Losses

[MrBurns]

This is now very serious, I dont envy Abbott or the Libs walking into this mess.

Job losses mean less retail spending means decline in the value of property means social unrest.

[prawn_86]

In this thread alone, we have reported 1284 job losses in the last week. Obvoisuly these wont all go into the next quarters numbers, as not all jobs will be lost this quarter, but just on this threads reporting jobs are being lost at a rate >180 per day

Of course no way of knowing, or us ASF members keeping track of how many have been employed to offset this number

[MrBurns]

The first two top stories on the ABC web site are about job losses, you don't see that every day.

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[Smurf1976]

Both the Caltex shutdown and the Qantas one carry similar broader risks, that being that we are losing our capacity to sustain basic industries within our own borders.

It's bad enough to need to import crude oil to put into the refinery but having to import a range of refined products is a greater strategic risk for sure. Likewise it's not good to be slowly but surely losing the ability to maintain aircraft, manufacture cars and so on.

What happens when we're next at war and such products and services are difficult if not impossible to import? We seem to have forgotten why many of these industries were set up in Australia in the first place, and the incredibly difficulties (wartime) under which some of them were established.

Aluminium smelting, steel production, ferro alloys, car and other machinery manufacture, oil refining, power generation and so on. All of them are strategic and most of them are of military concern if not able to be produced in adequate volume domestically.

[jank]

Seen this all before unfortunately. Australia is due for a tough few years ahead. These job loses are not surprising given the high cost of EVERYTHING!

[Aussiejeff]

In this thread alone, we have reported 1284 job losses in the last week. Obvoisuly these wont all go into the next quarters numbers, as not all jobs will be lost this quarter, but just on this threads reporting jobs are being lost at a rate >180 per day

Of course no way of knowing, or us ASF members keeping track of how many have been employed to offset this number

Of course, the situation is far, far worse - most of these job losses reported here and talked about are only the big ticket numbers that make the mainstream media headlines.

Meanwhile, thousands of small businesses (esp. service, manufacturing, retail, tourism etc) are no doubt quietly going about sacking staff and shutting up shop without making media headlines. Just as well for the gummint, eh?

In reality-land, prolly close to twice that number of employees (or more) are getting the boot each day across Australia. Say conservatively, 300-350 per day??



aj

[Eager]

...the Caltex shutdown...

Economies of scale is the overriding factor there (most modern refineries overseas are 10x the size - another reason why we should continue to import as many people as possible, to grow the country, instead of cling to a head-in-the-sand, 1950's insular attitude).

Their Brisbane refinery will remain, as will at least half a dozen other refineries around the country. Shutting refineries down is nothing new; BP used to operate one at Westernport etc.

The other factor of course is that it is not just the petro-chemical manufacturers but a large proportion of the manufacturing sector failed to invest when the times were good.

[Smurf1976]

I understand the point about scale, but there's an underlying reason behind it.

For whatever reasons, there simply wasn't enough investment so as to create a world scale operation in the past. That's a common situation in manufacturing, they just stop investing in the plant. Then it gradually runs down until the inevitable closure is announced.

I don't know the exact timing or reasons obviously, but Caltex effectively made a decision to close that refinery probably 20+ years ago when they stopped investing in it. They could have turned it into a huge operation that would be profitable but, for whatever reason, chose not to. I'm guessing that proximity to the city and other activities was probably a factor in concluding that massive expansion was simply too risky given the need to then remain at that site for another 30+ years. Given the location, it's not unforeseeable that there could be issues with surrounding land uses, environmental regulations etc within that timeframe.

It's like other industries, for example there's basically no investment now in the aluminium smelting industry. They've effectively made a decision to shut down, and are simply running the plants until either they physically fall apart or become so outmoded that cash flow goes negative. Then they close. Much the same could be said of various other industries too. They just aren't investing sufficiently such that closure is practically inevitable, the only real question being the timing.

A locally well known brick works not far from me closed down a few months ago. The official reason for closure was that it required too much investment to remain viable under modern environmental and OH&S requirements (it being the location of a very well publicised workplace accident a year or two ago). In reality however, there hadn't been major investment in the place since 1975 apart from a fuel conversion (from oil to sawdust) circa 1980. Everything is run down, a fact clearly obvious even from outside. Exactly when the "real" decision to close was made I don't know, but it was clearly a long time before the actual announcement.

So far as oil refineries are concerned, we've gone from 10 to 5 with the closure of both the Shell and Caltex refineries in Sydney (leaving no operating refineries in NSW).

[prawn_86]

2000 jobs to go from QLD Transport and Road-tek

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-07-3...nsport/4166238

[white_goodman]

I dont quite understand the point of this thread, theres always going to be job losses, as long as its offset by more job creation then who cares? Economies dont remain stagnant, otherwise we would still be supporting the cobb n co coach industry..

[prawn_86]

I dont quite understand the point of this thread, theres always going to be job losses, as long as its offset by more job creation then who cares? Economies dont remain stagnant, otherwise we would still be supporting the cobb n co coach industry..

Agreed, but it does seem as though the media is reporting a lot more job losses. Whether that is just their negative bias, or larger amounts of jobs are actually being lost, that is up for debate.

Back 4 or 5 years ago it was rare to see a report of a company sacking >100 staff yet now it seems to be becoming increasingly common. It would be nice if there was a way we could get the employment numbers reported also but have to wait for the surveys

[Ijustnewit]

News from Tasmania , 14 Border Protection / Customs jobs to go , ACL Bearings Launceston another 20 and UTAS Uni is calling for voluntary redundancies. Also Chicken Feed Bargain shops owned by Jane Cameron ( founder of Katmandu) is closing two Hobart stores.

[numbercruncher]

Another 2000 on the scrapheap courtesy of the incompetent Newman Government .....

Another 2000 Queensland public servants are bracing for a tap on the shoulder after the state announced a mass purge of transport workers in its multibillion-dollar cost-cutting drive.
Another 2000 Queensland public servants are bracing for a tap on the shoulder after the state announced a mass purge of transport workers in its multibillion-dollar cost-cutting drive.

There are now over 6500 confirmed job losses in the public sector since Premier Campbell Newman came to power in March, and he is eyeing another 13,500.

[MrBurns]

Another 2000 on the scrapheap courtesy of the incompetent Newman Government .....

LOL thats a bit rich he's only been in 5 minutes, no ....the loss of jobs and general downturn in everything except taxes is entirely the work of a Labor party !!!

[numbercruncher]

This is now very serious, I dont envy Abbott or the Libs walking into this mess.

Job losses mean less retail spending means decline in the value of property means social unrest.

Decline in property values = social unrest ? Haha good one .....

[numbercruncher]

LOL thats a bit rich he's only been in 5 minutes, no ....the loss of jobs and general downturn in everything except taxes is entirely the work of a Labor party !!!

He chose to sack them , he is clearly going to be as incompetent as the prior labor government .....


One pack of muppets overspends during the good times and the next pack of muppets underspends in the bad times, no minimum education or iq needed to be a politician it seems !

[white_goodman]

He chose to sack them , he is clearly going to be as incompetent as the prior labor government .....


One pack of muppets overspends during the good times and the next pack of muppets underspends in the bad times, no minimum education or iq needed to be a politician it seems !

of course its only fair if the private sector experiences downturns and loss of jobs, the public sector is the untouchables, holier than thou

[MrBurns]

Decline in property values = social unrest ? Haha good one .....

Lack of money = social unrest is what I was getting at.

But then the idea of marauding gangs of property developers does create a picture

[MrBurns]

He chose to sack them , he is clearly going to be as incompetent as the prior labor government .....
One pack of muppets overspends during the good times and the next pack of muppets underspends in the bad times, no minimum education or iq needed to be a politician it seems !

It's the same here in Vic, Labor blew the money now the Libs have to budget and hard, no money for nurses or the police, cuts here cuts everywhere - why ?
Well for a start we have to pay $1 Billion per year for 24 years for the desal plant we dont use and may never use.

And thats only the start.............

Desalination plant a $24 billion rust bucket

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vic...-1226388121424

Yes another great scheme by a reforming Labor Govt

[Smurf1976]

News from Tasmania , 14 Border Protection / Customs jobs to go , ACL Bearings Launceston another 20 and UTAS Uni is calling for voluntary redundancies. Also Chicken Feed Bargain shops owned by Jane Cameron ( founder of Katmandu) is closing two Hobart stores.

I reckon it's only a matter of time until ACL goes the same way as Coats Paton, APPM and the various other big factories in Tas which have died by a thousand cuts.

The thing most don't realise, and I was one of those until quite recently, is that ACL actually has some damn good stuff. It's not just a factory churning out mass market ball bearings or something like that as the name implies. There's a lot of precision involved there and it's not the sort of thing that could easily be re-established once it goes.

As for bargain shops, Chickenfeed might be closing at Eastlands (a major shopping centre in Hobart) but that's largely due to the high rents in that place. Bargain stores as a whole seem to be booming, and I take that as a sign of the economy. Chickenfeed itself emerged amidst the economic doom a bit over 20 years ago and even Woolworths entered the game at the time with their "Peanuts" stores.

This time around we've got Shiploads as the new one, and of course there's the national chain The Reject Shop now in the game as well. That we can support 3 major bargain store chains, one of which is very rapidly growing, speaks volumes about the overall economy in my opinion. The likes of Myer are struggling whilst the cheapest goods are selling well elsewhere. People aren't willing, or simply can't, pay top $ to buy better quality these days.